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Beginners Corner > Trex 450 questions.. help please...
 
 
CanadianRCnut
Heliman
Location: Strathmore, Alberta - Canada

I have two questions:

1. I find that the heli likes to "bounce" while trying to hover. Is it that I am loosing lift when I am changing the pitch and roll? Is there anything I can do to help this.

2. how do I find a sweet spot on the pitch/throttle arrangement. I am finding that either it will hover nicely at 1.5-3 ft from the ground or it wants to climb. I would like to increase my hover hieghts in increments for practice ie - 5 ft, then 8 ft etc.

any help would be great

Thanks

"with another day comes another attempt at flight"
08-04-2008 06:19 PM
 
 
doorman
Elite Veteran
Location: E.Berne, NY

What Equipment???

What servos and power are you using, and possibly Head Speed???

And what is your experience level???? This info will help us figure out what your problems might be....

Stan

If there is a cure for this, please don't tell me about it!!!
08-04-2008 09:27 PM
 
 
GroundMagnet
Senior Heliman
Location: St Louis

1. Bouncing could be the wind, if this is the case then it’s just a matter collective management (this will come with more stick time). Of course there are thing’s that can help reduce this effect. Higher headspeed, bigger heli (more mass) will help with this.

2. Your pitch curve is a personal thing but for someone beginning I would recommend a curve of something like this 45,57,50,75,100. As for increasing you’re hover height just use more pitch.

It sounded like you maybe wanted to increase you height using the pitch curve. I would not recommend this you need to do it through pitch and practice on holding the same altitude; this will lead to better collective management.

Of course this is all just a guess without knowing the details it’s hard to say for sure. Number one is a pretty common question though so I could be right on that one.

Do what you love and you'll never work a day in you're life.
08-04-2008 10:28 PM
 
 
GroundMagnet
Senior Heliman
Location: St Louis

RCnut

I just looked at your other post. If those are the blades you’re running, dump them. I would be surprised if your blades are tracking with them. If they are tracking badly this can cause issues like sluggish feeling controls, shorter flight time and hotter electronics. I have a set that I acquired and I could never get them tracking. Get the 325 pro woodies good blades, good price and decent performance.

Do a search on them blades, you won't need to read to far to understand what I mean.

Tony

Do what you love and you'll never work a day in you're life.
08-04-2008 10:37 PM
 
 
TJinGuy
Elite Veteran
Location: Socorro, NM - USA

Setup issues that can cause bobbing

- Low head speed requiring too much pitch to hover
- Blades out of track
- Loose linkage or other mechanical problem

Flying issues that cause it

- Wind
- Cyclic changes
- Moving the throttle stick up and down

- Chris

Variety+spice+life+supporting_paper_towel_industry=
King2+Rex450+Protos+Concept30
08-04-2008 11:36 PM
 
 
ruddernate
Veteran
Location: sulphur,Ok.

my issue was my crazy thumbs. i softened up my throttle curves and increased headspeed and it's much better. what tx?

http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t449835p1/

fly it like you stole it
08-05-2008 12:12 AM
 
 
CanadianRCnut
Heliman
Location: Strathmore, Alberta - Canada

To add more info to my situation:

My experience is very low (only flying this one for a week and an Axe CP for about a month)

Motor - 430L
Servos - Spectrum 75
Gyro - 401
Transmitter - Spectrum Dx6
Batteries are - Absolute Power 11.2v 2150 mAh

I have no idea what my head speed is or how to change it. I have been reading through my manuals and am working with it. I realize that the wind will greatly affect my lift but I still get a bit of "bounce" indoors with a constant throttle stick.

Linkages all look good and the blades are tracking perfect (wish I could say the same for the axe CP)

now to maintain a constant altitude in a no wind situation should I have to be working the throttle stick up and down much??

I realize that I am very new to this but I just wanted to get on the right track so I can work more on my tail position hovering.

Thanks guys

"with another day comes another attempt at flight"
08-05-2008 12:42 AM
 
 
CanadianRCnut
Heliman
Location: Strathmore, Alberta - Canada

Does anyone else agree about the 325 woodies pro blades? they seem to be a reasonable price. Are these a good blade for an inexperienced pilot like my self

"with another day comes another attempt at flight"
08-05-2008 12:51 AM
 
 
doorman
Elite Veteran
Location: E.Berne, NY

Yes To The Blades!!!

Yes a good set of woodies is all that you need at your level of experience and they will take you all the way to and through basic stunts too!!!!
I am thinking that the servos are a LOT of your problem.... without wind, you should be able to set the left stick at one position and the heli should really pretty much set there for a few seconds without moving up, down, or to either side....
The S-75 servos you have really do not "center" accurately enough, and that causes you to have to "chase" them for a constant trim... and you most likely could learn with them, But really I would suggest that you change these out and go with some Hitech 65hb or mg's.. not a big expense, but they will make it feel like a completely different machine....
I hope this will help you get past the problem you are having....
Oh and when you are flying a heli, or even hovering it, you can plan on moving one stick or the other or both ALL THE TIME... but these are very fine movements...
Good Luck, Stan

If there is a cure for this, please don't tell me about it!!!
08-05-2008 01:03 AM
 
 
CanadianRCnut
Heliman
Location: Strathmore, Alberta - Canada

Ok, I will change the blades and I will try with these servos for a while and see where I end up. Don't get me wrong though, this is a very nice heli to fly compared to the Axe cp. just wanted to fine tune a little if I could.

I still have lots to learn but looking forward to it

"with another day comes another attempt at flight"
08-05-2008 01:36 AM
 
 
TJinGuy
Elite Veteran
Location: Socorro, NM - USA

Just remember that when flying in a confined space like a garage, the heli makes a LOT of wind. It churns in and will bob up and down more than pretty much anywhere else.

If you are working on hovering and want to limit the bobbing, keep the heli about 12-16in off the ground. At that height you are heavily relying on the ground to hold the heli in the air. If you go higher, the heli is pushing enough air to hover without the help from the ground and will fly at whatever height if feels like.

As for head speed, tell us these things

- Motor and pinion
- Pitch curve
- Throttle curve

And then we can suggest where you can change things to improve how it flies.

Oh and yeah, the Align woodies totally rock. I run the 315s on my Rex and 325s on my Mini. Love em!

- Chris

Variety+spice+life+supporting_paper_towel_industry=
King2+Rex450+Protos+Concept30
08-05-2008 04:42 AM
 
 
Zaneman007
Key Veteran
Location: Texas - USA

I have to agree with the doorman.

325 pro woodies are good blades, so long as they don't look like bananas. Align is hit or miss on those blades.

I'd recommend moving up on servos, 65hb's are what I fly in my 450.

If you have set up the heli properly, it should just set there. A trex 450 is quite stable for its size, even in a mild breeze. I'd recommend to have some at your local hobby shop or a fellow flyer check it out.

It could be your inexperience or something could be loose in the head block. If it is a used heli, something could be worn.

P.S. practice hovering above 3 feet to get out of the ground effect.

Happy flying, Warning. this hobby is addicting.

I'd rather be flying
08-05-2008 05:15 AM
 
 
CanadianRCnut
Heliman
Location: Strathmore, Alberta - Canada

Ok, I went through both my heli manual and the Tx manual and whay I seem to have is as follows for pitch and throttle curves

Normal Throttle: Low 0%, Mid 50%, high 100%
Stunt Throttle: Low 100% Mid 85% High 100%

Normal Pitch: Low 35% Mid 50% High 95%
Stunt Pitch: Low 5% Mid 50% High 95%
Hold: Low 5% Mid 50% High 95%


not sure if this will help any more. oh and by the way I blew the belt and have been searching for sollutions about that on the forums. Luckily I just changed batteries and was about to take off when it snapped

"with another day comes another attempt at flight"
08-05-2008 03:01 PM
 
 
nmrs
Senior Heliman
Location: Austin, TX

Quote 
Normal Throttle: Low 0%, Mid 50%, high 100%

I think you'll want to bump that normal throttle curve up quite a bit. You ideally want your normal and st1 throttle and pitch curves to match from mid-stick up. That way, when you flip the switch, the heli doesn't jump on you. Also, with the normal throttle curve you are running, you may have too little head speed to keep the heli stable in a hover.

I would change your normal throttle curve to something like:

0 60 85 92.5 100 (assuming you have 5 point curves)

if you only have 3 point curve, use:

Low 0% Mid 85% High 100%

If it were my heli, I would also change your pitch endpoints to be 0 and 100 rather than 5 and 95. You can use the swash menu to increase or decrease the overall pitch range. By default it will be set at 60%. Raising it will increase your overall pitch. Decreasing it will decrease your overall pitch. This is just my preference, and not as important as fixing your normal throttle curve. I just like my pitch curves to go 0 - 100 and then use the swash menu to control the pitch envelope.

450 se v2
08-05-2008 03:20 PM
 
 
Skarn
Senior Heliman
Location: Pasadena, MD

Great advice here bro.

One thing...you say you blew your belt already.....have you removed your idler pulley?

Skarn

It's better to burn out than to fade away...
08-05-2008 03:44 PM
 
 
CanadianRCnut
Heliman
Location: Strathmore, Alberta - Canada

I have only 3 point curve on this Dx6 so I will change to what you recommended NMRS.

I have read about removing the pully and will try that. I am going to LHS today should I look for a spec ific belt or go with stock??

how many curve points does a Dx7 have? maybe I should look at up grading this winter.

"with another day comes another attempt at flight"
08-05-2008 04:08 PM
 
 
TJinGuy
Elite Veteran
Location: Socorro, NM - USA

Most the radios these days have 5 points for both the pitch and throttle curve. On your DX6, I would say try a 0-80-90 throttle curve and see how that does. Just be sure to throttle up very slowly and having "slow start" set on the ESC will help not have the heli spin when the motor starts up suddenly.

As for pitch curves, you really need to get the pitch gauge out and set your radio up using that. I too would recommend running 0 and 100 instead of 5 and 95.

- Chris

Variety+spice+life+supporting_paper_towel_industry=
King2+Rex450+Protos+Concept30
08-05-2008 05:11 PM
 
 
ruddernate
Veteran
Location: sulphur,Ok.

be sure and hold your tail boom up to the light and make sure your belt is not twisted a full turn. i also had belt trouble until i removed the idler pulley from the tail. no need to upgrade your dx7 imho. you should have 5 points on youre curves.

fly it like you stole it
08-05-2008 05:49 PM
 
 
CanadianRCnut
Heliman
Location: Strathmore, Alberta - Canada

well I double checked the receiver menu and the manual again and all I seem to have for throtle/pitch curves are low, mid, and high

Once I pick up my belt today I will re-assemble with out the idler and I will pay close attention to the belt in the tail boom. Is there a better direction to twist the belt? CW or CCW with looking from the rear?

"with another day comes another attempt at flight"
08-05-2008 05:59 PM
 
 
TJinGuy
Elite Veteran
Location: Socorro, NM - USA

You just gotta put the belt in there and then turn the blades CW and make sure the tail is turning so that the blades are moving down when looking at it from the back. Or CCW when looking at it from the right side of the heli. Think of it like this, if a blade hits a rock on the ground, it will knock it towards the heli and not away. Once you get it turning the right way, just make sure it doesn't click as you turn it.

So I guess thinking about it, the belt turns 1/4 turn CCW when looking at it from the back. But again, you just need to make sure the blades are all turning the right way and there is no rubbing.

- Chris

Variety+spice+life+supporting_paper_towel_industry=
King2+Rex450+Protos+Concept30
08-05-2008 06:08 PM
 
 
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Beginners Corner > Trex 450 questions.. help please...
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