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Fast Lad Performance . Ace Hobby . Esprit Model

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Radio - Servo - Gyro - Gov - Batt > Spartan Ds760 Issues
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

I have purchased 2 Spartan DS-760 Gyros. One is fitted to an Align 600 Nitro Pro the other to my Align 500 electric. I use a Spektrum DX-7 handset. I have fitted on the 500 a Futaba 9257 and on the 600 a JR 8900G tail servos.
Both Helicopters since fitting the Spartan Gyros have developed tail drift in head holding mode. In rate mode the drift vanishes ?? I have spent endless amounts of hours trying to fix the problem but nothing cuts it.........

I have run out of ideas to try because I have tryed them all..I have also tryed to contact Spartan RC but am still waiting for a reply ...... Am I expecting to much out of such a small gyro

Any thoughts would be much appreciated
Alex
06-03-2008 09:48 PM
 
 
ez2bgman
Elite Veteran
Location: N'awlins, LA

Did you set the tail blades to the recommended 8 degrees of pitch at mid stick? Angelos has stated previously here RR that the initial mid stick pitch need only be close to 8 degrees. I set mine up per the instructions and have had zero drift. Did you try going through the quick set up again? How do you have it mounted? I used the factory supplied gyro tape with the metal plate. At one point I noticed some drift in HH after I put a small Velcro strap around the gyro as added security. Once I removed the Velcro strap, the drift vanished.

Gary
RJX of USA
Magnum Fuels
SwitchGlo
>Hot Girlz in da gallery<
06-03-2008 10:21 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Autoeject
Key Veteran
Location: Ashtabula, OH, USA

Yes, how have you mounted them? Drifting in HH is almost certainly vibrations getting to the gyro.

Mark Webber
wai-rc.com
Spartan RC Distributor
Outrage Helicopters
06-03-2008 10:55 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

I have set up the 8 degree of pitch on the tail so when it is flicked to rate mode it will roughly stay where it is......

I have tryed so many different possibilities that it has really gone beyond a joke....

On my 600 the gyro is mounted on top of the two cyclic servos with the gyro wires seperate from the servo wires... Still drifts, tryed on the back tail box same thing.........

On the 500 it is mounted as far back on the tail box as possible with the gyro wires seperate from the servo wires.....

It just seems weird that everyone else can plug theirs straight in an it works perfectly.... For me it has been the total opposite....
06-03-2008 11:22 PM
 
 
bperry
Senior Heliman
Location: Detroit, where we eat the dead

Seems since you have 2 not working and doing the same thing it would be your setup, either radio or mechanical.

Is everything 90 degrees with no trim/subtrim?
What is your radio setup?
What tail Blades?
If the belt version is it slipping or have one to many twists?
How are the servos have they been crashed ?
Is the linkage system free from binding?

What gyro did you have before. It sounds like you didn't have a problem with that gyro.

Good luck it is no fun trying to fly a heli with an unstable tail.
06-03-2008 11:42 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rexxigpilot
Senior Heliman
Location: florida

Try some Zeal mounting tape. It will eliminate the vibration problem. My 760 is mounted on the servos of my 600N also. I use Zeal and have no problem with drift.
06-03-2008 11:42 PM
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

The main blades that I am running are V blade tst on the 600 and Align rotortech's on the 500.

The tail rotor blades are stock black carbons which came with the 600 nitro pro and on the 500 are the Align carbons....

I was very careful when installing my belt in the 500. I am running the belt at the correct tension.......

All the servos are brand new about 20 - 40 flights if that and uncrashed ( knock on wood )

I will never say spartan is crap ( excuse the french ) because I have seen them when they are in there prime.... I just mine could be that good...

I wish that I could get Zeal tape in the UK but I can't.....
06-03-2008 11:51 PM
 
 
raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

can i ask why you have a couple of threads atleast on helifreak from last few weeks where you fix the gyro/s and yet you always end up with something not working again? are you changing anything at all?

i wish i stayed closer to you, there is something in the setup you are missing/doing wrong. you have all the information you require on the various HF threads. just a question of getting whatever is wrong right. as you have said before on HF your other brand of gyro also done this on your 600n i believe it was so it is telling you something. finding what can be an annoyance.

as has been said drift is normally due to vibrations getting to the gyro but not limited to.

can be how it is mounted, wires too tight, revo mixing on, weak tail, gyro incorrectly setup, mechanical probs, engine tuning to name but a few.

i'm sorry i can't point you in a clear direction but there is little chance you have 2 bad gyros doing the same thing.

what did you do before that fixed the problems on HF and what have you done since to the heli? i.e crash, bling upgrades etc. i know once you had revo mixing on and that cured one of the helis from drifting.

also, do not worry about zeal tape, the stock pads are just fine when you select the correct combo to suit your application.

cheers


www.waterfoothelis.com
06-04-2008 12:35 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

Well to be honest I don't have a clue maybe im just hoping that someone will come up with an answer...
06-04-2008 04:01 PM
 
 
raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

an answer to what? you have said on helifreak the gyros work....i don't understand the problem

cheers


www.waterfoothelis.com
06-04-2008 04:05 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

Well the mechanical set up is correct, I can't see any vibrations but for some reason the heli's nose drifts to the left....
06-04-2008 05:52 PM
 
 
raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

you have a vibration or mounting issue as has been said before.

you will need to experiement with mounting methods and make sure the wires etc are not tight. also are you sure you don't have revo mixing on again?

i don't understand how the issues were fixed and they have returned again. what has changed?

cheers


www.waterfoothelis.com
06-04-2008 05:55 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

Beats me I honestly have tryed everything
06-04-2008 06:50 PM
 
 
MJA
Key Veteran
Location: Cumbria-UK

I have purchased 2 Spartan DS-760 Gyros. One is fitted to an Align 600 Nitro Pro the other to my Align 500 electric. I use a Spektrum DX-7 handset. I have fitted on the 500 a Futaba 9257 and on the 600 a JR 8900G tail servos.
Both Helicopters since fitting the Spartan Gyros have developed tail drift in head holding mode. In rate mode the drift vanishes ?? I have spent endless amounts of hours trying to fix the problem but nothing cuts it.........


Have you ever tried to trim out drift in idle-up mode with rudder trim and forgotten you've done it?

Reason i ask this is because the DX7 uses seperate rudder trims in each flight mode.If your trim is even 1 click off centre in idle up 1 or 2 it will appear to drift whenever you switch into them.It would do this because the gyro would calibrate to tx rudder stick and trim centre in normal flight mode which most likely would still be smack in the middle .

BUT if any of your idle ups are even 1 click off centre trim it will be seen as a command to yaw ie look like drift.

The rudder trim and stick centreing on the tx must be consistantly reliable because heading hold gyro's don't like it if they aren't, so it could also be an issue with your DX7's rudder channel centreing due to a fault.Go into the servo/channel
graph display screen and check it stays smack down the middle every time you move the rudder stick and drop it back to middle.Flick all the flight mode switches and check it stays the same also.

btw
I have same servo with heli combo as you but use a CSM720 on the T-rex 600 and a JR 770T on the T-rex 500.


Martin
06-04-2008 11:55 PM
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

I deffinately do not have any revo mixing, trims, subs trims active....
06-05-2008 12:22 AM
 
 
MJA
Key Veteran
Location: Cumbria-UK

I think you need to experiment with different hardnesses of
mounting pads,either that or you're very unlucky and both your gyro sensors are f**cked.
Possibly too vibration and or temperature sensitive,though i don't think there'll be much vibration on a Trex500,not compared to a Nitro
I suppose it's not impossible to have bad sensors slip through the net?
You need to try your gyro's on someone elses heli/setup if you still can't make anything of them.


Martin
06-05-2008 12:50 AM
 
 
Angelos
Key Veteran
Location: nr Oxford, OX11, UK

Mewsikman,
I have been reading your threads on Helifreak but didn't jump in as the people who ware helping you were already asking the right questions and suggesting solutions I would suggest. A couple of thinks however I would like point out. Most people that posted to your threads spent more time to write a suggestion than you spend to write a reply. "I have tried everything" does not really help in understanding what you did and how. You need to describe what you have done in such detail that someone standing next to you would have seen. Post good clear photos of how the gyro is mounted and how the gyro, servo and ESC wires are routed. Also detailed info on your heli, radio gear and power system. I do seem to remember than one of your helis already had one or two other gyros before the ds760 which both drifted. That points the problem somewhere else. Also if I remember correctly you got some improvement by borrowing an engine and you had some doubts whether the torque tube as ok? What happened with these changes? Drift problems are very difficult to diagnose as almost everything on the heli could be causing it from faulty bearings to electric disturbances, static etc. I am personally not a regular flyer and quite a few people on these forums have a lot more practical experience than me. I do however keep an eye on things and step in when technical information is needed. Provide as much detailed information as you can and someone may know something the rest of us don't instantly see. I have tried to include all the obvious things too check in the FAQ on our website.

MJA, admittedly it is not possible to test every gyro in real flying but every gyro we make is thoroughly tested on purpose designed fixture and then temperature calibrated from -18C to +58C giving an stable effective range over -10C to +50C. In that range any ds760 will not have the slightest temperature induced drift. We keep the calibration and test reports from every gyro we ever made and if I doubt I can dig it out and review it using the gyro's serial number. And you can also send your gyro back to us to be flight tested an no cost other than the return postage.

-Angelos

Spartan RC R&D - Visit us at our local club www.helicollective.org.uk
06-05-2008 02:17 AM
 
 
Mewsikman
New Heliman
Location: North Devon England

I had contacted the place that I purchased it from and was told that the gyro comes pre-set up for a 90 sized heli and that it would need extra settings to make it work on a Trex 500 or 600.........
06-05-2008 11:05 AM
 
 
raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

well i can safely say that is not true.

the gyro will work out the box with a 450-90 size. your using it on 2 of the helis i personally have it on. no tweaking required and no amount of gyro tweaking will fix drift. your looking at mechanical/setup issues there.

cheers


www.waterfoothelis.com
06-05-2008 01:32 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
tgo
Senior Heliman
Location: HK

I have the same DS760 tested on 600N + 9251, 600N + Hitec 6965, 500 +9257 and 450 V2, it works on great on all these helis, no special setup required except I have to change it to 760uS for 9251 only....

I never heard that it's factory setup for a 90 size heli !

TGO
06-05-2008 05:23 PM
 
 
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Radio - Servo - Gyro - Gov - Batt > Spartan Ds760 Issues
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