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Midland Helicopters . HeliProz . ZoomsHobbies

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Gasser Model RC Helicopters > Another plug reading thread?
 
 
rbort
Elite Veteran
Location: Franklin, MA - U.S.A.

I'm back

Just came back from night flying my 450 with a friend. Put in 6 flights, pretty cool looking at the night lights in the air!

In a gasser almost the opposite is true...set the low needle before the high in a way. I mean you can just put the high needle at 1 3/8 and its "good enough" and tweak the low needle to get that nice hover then do the full power climbouts and tweak the high needle for best performance.

But yes you have to set both to fly perfectly, though I'd say setting the low right is more critical to better flight that setting the high as it affects starting, idle, spoolup and alot of the hover.

Anyway, good night guys, catch you tomorrow sometime!

P.S. The dancing ghost (or is it a cloud?) is pretty damn funny!

-=>Raja.

1005 Xcell Gas, BHH G26 3D Plus, Jewel Generator
Spectra-g, BHH G26 3D Plus, Jewel Generator
06-20-2008 05:30 AM
 
 
aambrose
Elite Veteran
Location: Pana, IL

Quote 
what is important is what is it doing after it gets up to speed....
Just an FYI - We made 5 flights on the heli that day. Approximately 5-7 minutes on each flight with cool downs in between each flight (except between #4 and #5). The engine sounded great in the air each time. It was while spooling up on #5 that the engine sagged. I throttled back down, let it idle a few seconds then throttled back up slowly again and no problems.

jschenck,
Didn't intend to take away from your post. Sorry.

Thanks!


Tony
06-20-2008 03:04 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rbort
Elite Veteran
Location: Franklin, MA - U.S.A.

Richen the low end JUST a smidgen

When the engine sags on spoolup, you need to open the low end just BARELY to stop that. Do a small movement on the low needle and keep flying flight after flight to see if the sag goes away on spoolup. If so you're good. If its still there after a couple of flights then do it again a little more.

Usually it doesn't happen on a cold engine spoolup if your marginally lean on the low. Only when the engine is hot midflight and you land and wait a few seconds and try to take off again.

-=>Raja.

1005 Xcell Gas, BHH G26 3D Plus, Jewel Generator
Spectra-g, BHH G26 3D Plus, Jewel Generator
06-20-2008 04:28 PM
 
 
tkn0spdr
Heliman
Location: Indian Harbour Beach, FL USA

Does anyone know where I can download a copy of the G260 manual? Google didn't come through this time.

Thanks,
David
06-20-2008 04:31 PM
 
 
xcellgasman101
Elite Veteran
Location: WOODWARD, OKLA....

http://www.bonzisports.com/images/d...1pum.manual.pdf

John Crotts
www.soonerhelicamproductions.com
06-20-2008 04:37 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
AceBird
Elite Veteran
Location: Utica, NY USA

Raja>>>

Quote 
I mean you can just put the high needle at 1 3/8 and its "good enough" and tweak the low needle to get that nice hover then do the full power climbouts and tweak the high needle for best performance.

A$$man>>>

Quote 
Some helis, hover on the H needle, like the Spectra G, That is why I said to set the L needle to smooth idle and smooth transition.. Yes you will have to adjust the throttle trim for idle..

Can you believe it? They both fly the same heli…

Why don’t you experts get around a table as a group and decide what bull $hit you want to feed the newbies. Meanwhile I’ll take what I know from experience, what I have read in published manuals, and what I have learned from the engineering personnel at Walbro on how the carburetor is suppose to work.

Hover is more than likely a combination of both needles. The more weight the heli has the more the percentage will be from the high needle. With tons and tons of experience on a particular heli you can set either needle first and get “good enough” but with no experience you have one or two lean runs to get it right depending on your awareness and reaction time.

Best of luck to all you newbies.

Ace
What could be more fun?
06-20-2008 05:51 PM
 
 
xcellgasman101
Elite Veteran
Location: WOODWARD, OKLA....

AceTurd,, If you read english,, We are both saying the same thing....You are telling 3 pilots that have over a combined experiance of over 30 plus years of flying a gas heli, "Were WRONG"!!! and you with your year or so, and ONE GALLON of fuel, you know more that us,, Ok,, "Were WRONG"



I'll keep tunning my engine my way, and they last for 100's of gallons,,, I have helped several people here in the last couple of week from this topic in PM's,, and everyone of then have there engine running more smoothly, With OUT burning them up,, Go Figure,,, XGM/VGM

John Crotts
www.soonerhelicamproductions.com
06-20-2008 06:17 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rbort
Elite Veteran
Location: Franklin, MA - U.S.A.

Ace

Burn some gas man...! How many gallons have you gone through this year? I lost count myself but I got my flight numbers in my head, 490 Spectra-g and 1850 Xcell gasser - I evened them out last time out... I'll be posting the 500 Spectra-g milestone flight topic as soon as I get there!

-=>Raja.

1005 Xcell Gas, BHH G26 3D Plus, Jewel Generator
Spectra-g, BHH G26 3D Plus, Jewel Generator
06-20-2008 07:29 PM
 
 
jschenck
Elite Veteran
Location: La Vista, NE.

Quote 
http://runryder.com/helicopter/t426711p1

Just 'cuz I started it doesn't make it mine This benefits us all, the more info we have for tuning success the better.

Unfortunantly I haven't had a chance to fly the last few days and I don't know if I'll get to fly this weekend. - I'll report back as soon as I have more info.

...yep...
06-21-2008 06:28 AM
 
 
Eleven_Bravo
Senior Heliman
Location: Modesto,CA

Quote 
3 pilots that have over a combined experience of over 30 plus years of flying a gas heli


Quote 
lost count myself but I got my flight numbers in my head, 490 Spectra-g and 1850 Xcell gasser - I evened them out last time out... I'll be posting the 500

490 15 minute flights = 7350 minutes = 122.5 hours

You use a 16oz dubro tank I know you don't but were going to assume you use the whole 16oz in the 15 minutes so thats 8 tanks in a gallon.

490/8= 61.25 gallons

I will make the same assumptions about the 1005

1850 15 minute flights = 27750 minutes = 462.5 hours

1850/8= 231.25 gallons

For a grand total of 585 hours of flying thats a bit over 24 days straight.

My conclusion is when it comes to my money and the Spectra-G thats coming my way in the future my engine that I am paying for SIMPLE COMMON SENSE tells me who I am going to listen to when it comes to setup and tuning.

Thank you both John and Raja for your help.

Donald

Its not a maneuver until your looking down on it. ~Jason Krause~ Phoenix FF 08
06-22-2008 02:59 AM
 
 
AceBird
Elite Veteran
Location: Utica, NY USA

Quote 
My conclusion is when it comes to my money and the Spectra-G thats coming my way in the future my engine that I am paying for SIMPLE COMMON SENSE tells me who I am going to listen to when it comes to setup and tuning.

And when they disagree you will be screwed ... cause they sure do disagree from time to time.

Ace
What could be more fun?
06-22-2008 08:55 PM
 
 
sean911sc
Senior Heliman
Location: San Diego, CA

Questions.

Yes - I'm new to gassers and heres my setup/and situation:

Zenoah G230RC w/ WT603
Benzin fenstron mechanics converted to P&B (gear ratio 9.09:1 )
Vario 4-blade head (rotor dia 1680mm) Helitronix mixer
Camper fuel mixed with 3oz of AMSOIL 100:1
L & H are 1 3/8
Pitch range -3 to 11 (+5 at mid)
Throttle butterfly open 1/2 - servo at 50% 90 degrees.
Throttle ATV 100/100
Pitch ATV 100/100
Trim at 1/2 sets idle is 6 to 10% (variable)

Trying to get the target HS of 1350, but the bird wants to hover at 1500 - 1600 at 6.5 pitch.

Taching (all 4 blades stop - thats HS).

I've been doing low level and small circuits about 15ft of deck and engine seems to sound fine, but I don't have any local helis to reference as everything is either nitro or electrin.

I'm I looking at an engine tune or gear ratio to hit 1350 or is this a case of simply finding whatever RPM will lift the heli?

The heli is basically a Benzin Trainer

Sean
Logo 600 3D APR-1
Logo 500 3D APR-2
Vario EC135
06-22-2008 10:19 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
xcellgasman101
Elite Veteran
Location: WOODWARD, OKLA....

Have you tried to lower your throttle curve at hove?? to bring it down to the target HS?? I would say the 1600 HS is to high for a 4 blades head, IMHO.. XGM/VGM

John Crotts
www.soonerhelicamproductions.com
06-22-2008 11:05 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
AceBird
Elite Veteran
Location: Utica, NY USA

Numbers don't seem to be jiving unless you are lifting a 30 pound plus heli.

Ace
What could be more fun?
06-22-2008 11:54 PM
 
 
sean911sc
Senior Heliman
Location: San Diego, CA

It seems to be a dance as I know I've had it hovering in the 1350 area (blades have a distinct sound at the lower RPM).

This mornings session wouldn't left unless stick at 3/4 and thats 8° when aiming for 1350. I set out to rework T-curves so I set points 2-4 (pitch) to 5° and started with 10% across on throttle and increased until 1350. It wouldn't hover until 3/4 stick (8°) and that point its outside the 1350.

I'm going to test again shortly. EDIT: Got a solid hover and low level FF with HS of 1490 at 3/4 stick.

Thanks I'll hash it out as this thread isn't about multi blade gassers. I'll figure it out.

Sean

EDIT: I was reading the tach incorrectly. Bird is up with GV1/SG set for 1250. Its a joy to fly.

Sean
Logo 600 3D APR-1
Logo 500 3D APR-2
Vario EC135
06-23-2008 02:25 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
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Gasser Model RC Helicopters > Another plug reading thread?
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