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Got Jet Fuel? Turbine Helicopters > Without Bad Luck I wouldn't have any luck at all!
 
 
lperagallo
Senior Heliman
Location: Westfield, Indiana, USA

OK,

so Duralite gets me the battery back so I decide I should finish the rebuild on the turbine. All I need to do is put the tail on, mount blades, check linkages and test.

I put the battery back in and decided that I'd test the start sequence and make sure things work. First thing I find is that I reversed the plugs on the Gas solenoid and Kero solenoid. Easy mistake, the markings on the FADEC are hard to understand. Try again. This time the gas valve opens and I see gas shooting out the front. Gosh, bad festo fitting. Now I have to take the nose off the turbine and replace the festo. To do this I had to take apart a bunch of the wiring and electronics to get to it. I get it taken apart, check the fitting and sure enough it is leaking. I put on an new one and put it all back together.

Try again. I hear the solenoid cycling but no "pop". Next check is the glow plug. I take it out and test, works fine. Then I check the valve again. It works, gas is coming out. I decide to blow through the line. Oh Boy, can't do it. Need to take the nose off AGAIN Check the fitting, it's clear. Try to blow out line, No Go. So I decide to take a small needle and push it through. I was able to get it in a bit but then it stopped. I pushed it in and out a few times and took it out. Since I don't know what it looks like on the other end I wasn't going to force anything. I tried to blow through it again and it's clear

Put it all back together AGAIN! Try it again. It starts right up. I immediately shut it down and try again. No luck, data port says bad glow. I take it out and its toast, so I put in a new one. You have to tease out two coils with a needle to get it to work. I take out three. Try again. Works!, Try again, Bad Glow plug on the data port

Take out another glow plug, tease out TWO coils and put it back in. Success

So I've gotten it all back together. I'll give it a try tomorrow where I can fire it up completely. It's going to be windy, so I might just test it on the ground. OH, I know, I'll have JC hold it over his head and I can run it up and check the tracking. That way I won't have to worry about crashing!

Let's hope I've used up all my bad luck,
Lou

Bergen Intrepid EB, G-26, 720mm; Bergen Turbine, Wren MW54; Raptor 50V2, OS50-Hyper
04-26-2008 04:24 AM
 
 
chopper jockey
Senior Heliman
Location: uk

hell, I remember when I had problems like that when I used to start with gas... never looked back since I moved up to kero start. good luck!
04-26-2008 12:02 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
windy62
New Heliman
Location: USA

What are the downsides, if any, to a kero start system?

Expense?

Batteries?

igniter?

windy62
04-26-2008 02:18 PM
 
 
bcook01
Heliman
Location: Abaco, Bahamas

re kero start

Any news about Wren implementing Kero start?

Attempts at analizing governor potentialon the mw54?

Seems like there is little progress.



Windy......... mostly $$$. understand the ignitors have improved. Would be nice if Wren would support the necessary changes and provide the hardware.

Bob

You cannot afford to learn by your own mistakes.
04-26-2008 04:13 PM
 
 
lperagallo
Senior Heliman
Location: Westfield, Indiana, USA

I believe that Wren is close to having a Kero start for their engines. I have heard that Kero starts is hard on batteries, but I have no experience with it. It will probably come out with the MW44. I'll ask Sara as she can no longer post here.

Lou

Bergen Intrepid EB, G-26, 720mm; Bergen Turbine, Wren MW54; Raptor 50V2, OS50-Hyper
04-26-2008 08:26 PM
 
 
MattJen
Key Veteran
Location: UK,Gravesend, Kent

the initial start up on the battery with the kero start is high.
JC have recently bought a version 3 ceramic plug out which is better,
i had the the original version and had a lot of problems.

My luck on turbines has also been terrible,if it was not one thing it was another.
So dont worry you are not alone, i know some guys that use other makes seem to be having a bad run of luck recently, wether it is flame outs or aligment problems.So bad luck is not limited to JC.

it happens, and when it does it seems to come in 3's,

now the warm weather is nearly here it will be great to fire up them up.

Matt Jenner

I bought my Mother-in-law a chair for xmas, but she wouldn't plug it in
04-26-2008 10:05 PM
 
 
lperagallo
Senior Heliman
Location: Westfield, Indiana, USA

Matt,

Today I did some test run up and starts and things seem good. The 30MHP kept me from lift off because I didn't want anything to happen. I did fly the Gasser. Boy were down wind runs fast. It was like being shot out of cannon when I turned down wind. The nose was at a scary attitude when coming back into the wind.

My issues with the turbine haven't been engine related, one was stupid because I neglected to notice that I had no aileron control upon spool up, one because a battery died completely after 3 minutes, even though it tested fine with a 1 amp load, and the third was a torque tube dog bone issue.

Hopefully I've gotten all the issues fixed and I can do some great flying again. I had really built up some good confidence and was doing quite a bit of aerobatics and working on real smooth circuits with fast flight.

I'm a bit gun shy now, so it will take some time to get comfortable again.

Weather is finally improving here so I'll be able to get more stick time.

Lou

Bergen Intrepid EB, G-26, 720mm; Bergen Turbine, Wren MW54; Raptor 50V2, OS50-Hyper
04-27-2008 01:09 AM
 
 
WIRLYBIRD
Senior Heliman
Location: CAPE TOWN / SOUTH AFRICA.

Lou , what was the dog bone issue?
Dave.

WHAT GOES UP MUST SURELY COME DOWN.
04-27-2008 05:13 AM
 
 
Bell Bloke
Veteran
Location: England

Iperagallo, turbines are strange in the beginning but once you get used to some of the setting up stuff you won't make the same mistakes again and you will see how easy they are to run.
As for kero start, if you go down that path don't think that things will be any easier than with a gas start as all you are doing is replacing one set of minor issues with another.
I think the best thing to do would be to get used to the engine first, get some hours on it, and then when you are ready, then think about upgrades. Otherwise in this game I personally have found you will and up chasing your tail when buying add ons.
Basically keep it simple and keep it standard, that way any faults or problems will be easier to work out.
As for gas starting, once you get the plug teased out correctly and the gas set, that's it. It should then give no more problems.
Plugs can last for years if left alone and are cheap to replace if they break.............Cheap, simple and low tech.
all the best, Bell Bloke.
04-27-2008 12:45 PM
 
 
lperagallo
Senior Heliman
Location: Westfield, Indiana, USA

Wirlybird,

The Dog Bone issue was that the set screw wasn't set properly in a dimple that was made too small. Then the torque tube spun and I had no Tail control. Didn't hit throttle hold, just slammed it into the ground from about 8 feet. Dumb move on my part, as I have yet to get over not panicking when I lose the tail. I can auto OK, but I just lose it when the tail breaks away.

Believe it or not I had another tail breakaway today on my Gasser when the pin in the fitting that drives the dog bone sheared off. Guess what, I panicked again and slammed the heli into the ground. I am really getting tired of myself doing that

Of course this after the Wren decided it wasn't going to start today. I get this wonderful explicit message on the data port "Start Bad". As if I didn't know that

Bergen Intrepid EB, G-26, 720mm; Bergen Turbine, Wren MW54; Raptor 50V2, OS50-Hyper
04-27-2008 07:44 PM
 
 
Bell Bloke
Veteran
Location: England

Why so many tail problems? Are they related?
04-27-2008 08:48 PM
 
 
lperagallo
Senior Heliman
Location: Westfield, Indiana, USA

No, they are not related, just very untimely I had little warning signs I missed just before the issues. I'm now better prepared, but it's a heck of a way to learn.

Lou

Bergen Intrepid EB, G-26, 720mm; Bergen Turbine, Wren MW54; Raptor 50V2, OS50-Hyper
04-27-2008 09:01 PM
 
 
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Got Jet Fuel? Turbine Helicopters > Without Bad Luck I wouldn't have any luck at all!
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