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Got Jet Fuel? Turbine Helicopters > 1 Stage vs 2 Stage...
 
 
dr-rudie
Heliman
Location: Sydney - Australia

Hi all,


So I'm thinking about embarking down the turbine path, and naturally I'm coming accross a number of questions...

Most importantly I'm deciding on the best model for my needs. So at the moment I'm looking at the Jetcopter SX. Everything seems pretty good for my needs, but I'm curious as to whether I should look down a different avenue towards a model with a 2 Stage turbine. I understand the 2 stage will provide more power and better fuel economy.

So I guess my question is, if everything else on the Jetcopter is as I need, is it worth looking elsewhere soley for the inclusion of a 2stage? A powercat for example?

Thanks for the thoughts.
03-20-2008 12:36 AM
 
 
MattJen
Elite Veteran
Location: UK,Gravesend, Kent

The Powercat uses the PHT3 single stage turbine, the mechanics are designed around that particular turbine...

The only machine in pod and boom format that use the Second stage turbine as far as i know

Is the the following

PREDATOR - WREN 2 STAGE

VARIO ACROBATIC - USES WREN 2 STAGE/ JETCAT 2 STAGE

VARIO XLV - WREN 2 STAGE /JETCAT 2 STAGE

The machines above require you buy the normal kit then throw most of it away and buy a turbine conversion which normally means upgraded frames and base plate plus other parts - can be seen as an expensive way - as on the XLV for example all that is kept from the original donor is the head,tail,Boom,Skids.

Powercat - single stage jetcat - comes as machine with turbine

Jetcopter - don't know this machine - seems very similar in design to the old Jetcat Hotcat, uses single stage turbine - unsure of suitability for a 2 stage turbine...

Bergen - Uses Wren 2 stage, never owned a bergen - from bergen thread good customer support but it is a complicated machine. maybe not a beginner into turbines ideal first pod and boom turbine... My opinion only ---as they are not popular over in the Uk.

Len Mount Oddessy - uses Jako turbine , single stage

There is also a pod and boom which is made in Australia, uses Wren 2 stage... comes from Sean Brown leamington hobby

Matt

I bought my Mother-in-law a chair for xmas, but she wouldn't plug it in
03-20-2008 12:58 AM
 
 
MattJen
Elite Veteran
Location: UK,Gravesend, Kent

For information,
this was posted in closed thread, which explains about the 2 types of turbines currently on the market..

Matt

The single-stage engine takes the power for the rotors from the shaft of a turbine engine. It is an effective way of doing things for model helicopters but isn’t appropriate for full-size helicopters, as it doesn't make use of the exhaust gases in any way and therefore wastes a lot of energy.

Two-stage engines were developed in full-size aviation to make better use of the power produced by a jet engine.
A jet engine uses the “suck-squeeze-bang-blow” principle and the hot gases streaming out from the exhaust provide propulsion (thrust). However, this is very inefficient and a large amount of the heat energy is wasted. So a method was devised whereby the hot gases were channelled through gas passages and used to turn a second turbine, which powered a turboprop propeller or helicopter rotor.
This gives three main parts to a two-stage engine:
First stage, the jet engine which generates the gases.
Second stage, the gas passage (interstage guide vane) and second turbine (power turbine)
Gearbox, with a shaft from the power turbine and reduction gears transferring the power to a prop or rotor.
Two-stage engines are about 4 times more efficient than the single stage jet engines, giving much more power from the same amount of fuel. That's why passenger planes started to use turboprops and now use turbofans, which are a further development of the same principle.


I bought my Mother-in-law a chair for xmas, but she wouldn't plug it in
03-20-2008 01:05 AM
 
 
Qrrambero
Veteran
Location: San Francisco / Bay Area

Here is another two stage Turbine



Ae
03-20-2008 02:26 AM
 
 
chopper jockey
Senior Heliman
Location: uk

Quote 
The machines above require you buy the normal kit then throw most of it away and buy a turbine conversion which normally means upgraded frames and base plate plus other parts - can be seen as an expensive way - as on the XLV for example all that is kept from the original donor is the head,tail,Boom,Skids.

Come now Matt, You don't "throw most of it away". A conversion kit is nothing much more than a new set of frames and an engine mount. If anything, "you keep most of it" I would say.
03-20-2008 10:54 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
MattJen
Elite Veteran
Location: UK,Gravesend, Kent

thats what you told me!!!! when i wanted to buy a new XLV conversion,
you said to me, it was a waste of money, you are better looking for a second hand donor kit as you throw most of it away for the turbine conversion..

Only repeating what you as a professional pilot told me.

but i stand corrected, instead of saying throw the parts, you dont, you put to them one, side, just in case you want to convert it back to a gasser,
but 9/10 once you have tasted turbine flying you don't normally revert back



Matt

I bought my Mother-in-law a chair for xmas, but she wouldn't plug it in
03-20-2008 11:06 AM
 
 
FCM
Elite Veteran
Location: Back in Blighty!

I agree with Matt - I have so much XLV stuff laying around that will never be used by me on my Hobby parts XLV conversion. Next one I do, I will see how much it costs to just order the parts required instead of the whole XLV Petrol kit. My situation is possibly not normal though as I am also using the 3 blade head, 4 blade tail rotor and Hobby Parts grips - anyone need 5 x Vario XLV blade grips and a complete 2 blade head?

Paul.
03-20-2008 01:07 PM
 
 
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Got Jet Fuel? Turbine Helicopters > 1 Stage vs 2 Stage...
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