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HIROBO Freya - Sceadu - Shuttle > Sceadu 50, is it a ripoff?
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

I waited to ask this question till more people could answer it. Tell me what you think.

OK, I have a Sceadu 50. I am happy with it. My question is how does Hirobo justify the cost difference between the 30 and 50 versions of this machine? The only item that is truly an upgrade between the two is the fiberglass blades. So why the 90 dollar increase? This makes very little since to me. Oh the fiberglass blades are crap too.

The only physical difference between the 2 machines is the below. These items require no extra machining between the 30 and 50.
Engine mount
Clutch bell pinion
flywheel

These are the only TRUE upgrade.
main blades

Yes, I am stirring up a bit of controversy, I want to know what the real answer is.

Ken B
10-05-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
CCoker
Senior Heliman
Location: Atlanta,GA

Sceadu

I was wandering the same thing,It sounded kind of strange.
10-05-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Steve Campbell
Elite Veteran
Location: Baton Rouge, LA

And the cooling shroud is an upgrade, right???

Steve
10-05-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Hirobo Upgrade cooling cover

Cooling cover: $19.95 Pt # 0412-555


OK, no one bother Jeff Green for the above, he will deny it's existence.

Actually I was looking at my empty tide bottle today, I can cut that sucker up and make a decent shrowd. I'll let you guys know how I do it later.

I have a project tomarrow! Since I'm waiting for parts anyway.


(I'm only joking around)

Ken B
10-05-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
richardf
Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA Posts: Billions and Billions

Blades

Ken,

What didn't you like about the FRP 570 MM blades included in the Sceadu 50 Kit? Was there a problem with the balance, finish or flight characteristics?

Richard.
10-05-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

570 blades on a 50 Sceadu

Here's the down and dirty on the 570 blades on a machine with a 50 size engine. I have one question, WHAT WAS HIROBO THINKING?

Hmm, when I balanced them they it took 2 layers of tape to get them in and square. Also you need to remove the brass insert (3mm ID) that they come with installed and slide in a new insert (4mm ID). This is not acceptable.

When I destroyed the blades when I hit a fence (long story) I discovered just what these where made of. The inside is hollow with a thin piece of wood to balance them cord wise. The outer surface is thin fiberglass.

I guess it's not all that the blades are crap but it's the idea that they think you should run 570's on a OS 50 engine. They caused head OVER speed problems for me.

It's obvious that the blades are not truly meant for this machine. If you have ever flown a 46/50 class machine did you ever hear of anyone that had good results from running short blades? The industry standard is 600's It's what the GPH 346 comes with. So why not include 600's in with this kit. There is enough room for the tail rotor. Heck you can run 620s in that case.

Finally, I have flown the Sceadu with 600mm blades and it is truly a HUGE difference. I recommend this length blade for anyone putting the 50-size engine into the Sceadu. I have read that the 620's kick butt too.

I guess it comes down to this, I can get a decent set of 600mm carbon blades for the 70-90 dollar difference between the machines. I'd rather the 50 didn't come with a set of blades at all, then cost as much as the 30. This way I could take the savings and get my own 600's.

Finally, I did some pricing around they are charging an arm and a leg for the 50 motor mount compared to the 30. The 30 mount honestly looks like it might be a shuttle Z type mount. Can anyone confirm that?

Ken B
10-06-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Steve Campbell
Elite Veteran
Location: Baton Rouge, LA

YOU GOT TO BE KIDDING!!!!!!!!

The cooling shroud IS an upgrade? Man, I was just being a weisenheimer; I didn't realize it was a pertinent question. Good grief...

My newbie is looking hard at this thing for a second ship. I think I'll dissuade him.

Steve
10-06-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

HAHA, Steve

Steve,
I was kidding about the cooling shrowd. Maybe I should have made it more obvious.

BTW, I added the just joking comment after your above post. I don't want my twisted sense of humor being mis-interepreted again

Sorry

Ken B
10-06-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Steve Campbell
Elite Veteran
Location: Baton Rouge, LA

Okay. But didn't I read somewhere where the Sce-whatever has some overheating problems? I could have sworn that one of those posts said there was no cooling shroud per se.

You got me, volkul! No big deal, 'cause Steve don't do Hirobo, but I've got a newbie chomping at the bit to buy another ship, and he's been looking at this one.

Interesting comments re the 57cm blades with the 50 version. They sound like some junk that Irwin was selling a few years back. Those had so little inertia, a friend's MyStar 46 engine died in five foot hover, and the head stopped turning before the machine hit the deck with a crunch. We dissected one and found mainly air...

Steve
10-07-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Actually

There is a cooling shrowd, it is identical to the Freya in construction. Meaning that it extends from the fan to the cylinder head. Once it is to the cylinder head it comes to an abrupt end. For the Freya this has not been an issue for me.

There was one individual (Hakim) that hit practically every forum he said he was having cooling problems. (BTW he is in Kenya) He and I have talked a little and it might be true. But I'm kinda waiting to hear how others make out before I chime in on it.

My engine on my Sceadu is presently dead and I am awaiting parts for the engine and Sceadu. My engine has been giving me nothing but trouble since day one. The OS 50 that I installed in it had similar problems to what Hakim had. So I'm going to try making a cooling cover extension and see if that helps it out. My problem is more likly that I absolutly suck at tuning engines. But hey...who knows.

I am not the kind of guy to slander something till I am justifed. Like with the 570 blades. Steve, you hit the nail on the head when you mentioned nothing but air inside the blades.

On a bright note: When I did have things running, the Sceadu with the OS 50 and 600mm blades ROCKS. It is my favorite to fly when it's flying. So much so I am thinking of replacing my SXX with a Sceadu 30.

Ken B
10-07-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

cooling shroud

I went and did it. I designed a cooling shroud extension for the Sceadu. If you want to see it go to the COOLING SHROUD page

I'll try to get pictures up later. For now there is a drawing and instructions.

Ken B
10-07-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

pictures

I added pictures to my page for the shroud.
shroud

Ken B
10-08-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ravenhawk
Heliman
Location: florida

I HAD AN OVERHEATING PROBLEM

i have the os32 in my sceadu i have a test stand buikt that stand about 6 ft tal it consists of a 3 by 3 plywood base 2 3/4 inch pieces a 2 inch conduit with the adapters that r round that can be threaded into and a top made of plywood that i strap my heli down on it spins and is over my head i made this just to dial in my helis engines and even with this my os 32 that i took out of my raptor which at the time was running fine took me almost a week to get it to run right
i finally turned the high speed needle in all the way and backed out 1 turn then turned in the low side all the way and backed out 2 turns and kept goin out on the low side till i got the engine to run at as tweaked as possible with throttle all the way down and trim all the way up
then started with the high side and increasing throttle as i opened the low side needle more and more till i got to half throttle then finnally got it to run perfect now it runs great and no more overheating or leaning out but go figure somethin had to go wrong just as i ran it one last time the start hex adapter cam loose and went down on top of my main gear and stoped it long enough at full throttle to chew up 5 teeth off my main gear damm i was almost ready to go fly now awaitng new gear
oh well ill just go crash my lmh a few times thats always a stress reliever and it usually gets at least 5 flights before i finaaly break the frame and then break out the 5 minute expoxy and im off again
thats my input for now
11-08-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Greg Takacs
Veteran
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Here are my thoughts on the matter:
- the 570 glass blades that come with the Sceadu 50 are really made for the 30, not the 50.
-It would be nice to get the $70 price break and get to pick your own blades.
- It is notr true that 50 class helicopters cannot be run with 570mm blades. In europe they run the Schluter Mosquito Expert 50 with 540mm blades. Of course here in the US 600mm is standard for 50 class helis.
- I have never had any overheating problems with my Sceadu 50.
11-08-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
BladeRunner
Elite Veteran
Location: Ontario Canada. Member of "some sort" s

Sceadu 50

Hey volkul, I don't know anything about the Sceadu, but, the blades you listed sure seem on the lame side for a 50 size heli. On the same subject, I was a bit frosted to see that my CS comes with such nice aluminum arms and bearings everywhere,and then ship with a PLASTIC tail pitch lever! That's like takeing delivery of your new Porsche and discovering it has a VW steering wheel! It took me about 5 min. to get hold of Heliproz and get the aluminum pitch lever that SHOULD have come in the kit, makes ya wonder "what were they thinking?" I'm sure that the plastic lever works fine-but geez with the price of this kit I expected a bit more. -------BladeRunner.
11-08-2001 Over year old.
 
 
richardf
Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA Posts: Billions and Billions

Enya 50

Ken,

Have you started the break in process on the new motor?

Richard.
11-09-2001 Over year old.
 
 
z11355
rrMaster
Location: 10000 is enough time wasted.

While I generally agree on the 570 blades, if you look at the
diameter disk swept out by a Skidoo head w/ 570's vs. most
machines w/ 600, I think you'll find them to be quite similar
because the blade bolt distance on the Skidoo/Freya is alot
more than the 'usual' machine.

Plus the fact that they probably had a bunch of 570's sitting
in a warehouse and they needed to justify the big price
difference of the two machines even though the true cost
diff. is almost nothing.

Just let me buy my own blades.

So you actually bought that $110 overpriced tail lever?
Gotta love that JR/KSJ.
11-09-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Ken B
Elite Veteran
Location: Phoenix, AZ

Enya 50

Richard,

I started the break in but my problem is that I can't get the idle to come in on it. A couple times I started it at a mid throttle setting and it ran good. Just having a hard time with the idle.

Worse thing is that the problem is a new one. Never had an engine act like this so I got to figure it out.

I'm sure it has allot to do with the Mixture settings. I jacked them up when I installed the throttle extention. WHOOPS.

But if first impressions mean anything the engine is going to be a winner. Mid and high ran good. I got 2 tanks through it.

Ken B
11-09-2001 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
richardf
Veteran
Location: San Diego, CA Posts: Billions and Billions

Engines

Ken,

Thanks for the progress report.

I didn't get the Enya 50 yet, but my YS-63 4 stroke did get here. Guess what I'm going to do tonight when I get home from work...

First hint, trim the crank shaft length down to size.

Richard.
11-09-2001 Over year old.
 
 
Optech
Key Veteran
Location: Vista/Oceanside, CA.

Enya .50 Idle problems

The problem with the Enya .50 carb is the design of the idle circuit. Its a two needle system that is an old design. I don't know why Enya still insists on designing their carbs this way. I've got the airplane version of this engine and have tried everything I know to get it to idle. I've bought new parts to no avail. In fact, two of the low speed needle I've received had different tapers to them. Neither has worked. As far as I'm concerned the engine is a control-line engine til a proper carb can be found for it. It runs great at full speed but the carb just sucks.

The first problem is the way the low speed needle meters the fuel coming out of the main jet. The low speed needle is a tapered design that meters fuel by sliding into the main jet. If for some reason the needle is jammed into the main jet hole, the hole is widened and the adjustment will never be correct. You can inadvertantly widen the hole while playing with the carb after you unpack the engine if you don't first back out the needle. Also, you must very gently screw in the needle when you want to find the bottom. If you screw it in and bottom out too hard, or force it to be tight, you can widen the hole or even crack the main jet opening.

The other problem is that in order to get the idle adjustment set, the engine barrel must be opened to the position you want it to idle at which point the needle is turned in till it stops, then backed out the appropriate number of turns. OK... all fine and dandy but what happens when you now close the throttle all the way to kill the engine???? You got it, the low speed needle gets jammed into the main jet hole. If you try to set the idle needle with the throttle all the way closed, at the idle position the setting is way too rich. Its a total no win situation on a heli. The OS low speed needle meters fuel by sliding over the main jet hole which is a "Cat Eye" type of hole. This is a much better way to do it as the adjustment can be set no matter where the throttle barrel is in the low speed portion of its travel.

Through all the parts, all the runs, all the adjustments, I never did get a satisfactory idle. At best it would idle for a few seconds but the transition to full speed without coughing or quiting could never be achieved. It seems I could never get the carb lean enough.

I know one fix for the older OS .46 engine was to file a slot in the carb barrel or drill a hole in the carb body to lean things out for idle and transition. This MAY be a fix for this engine as well.

Let me know what you find,
Mike
11-10-2001 Over year old.
 
 
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HIROBO Freya - Sceadu - Shuttle > Sceadu 50, is it a ripoff?
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