RunRyder - servo problems (NOW SOLVED) I think.

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RJX Hobby Hurrican 50 - Xtreme 50 > servo problems (NOW SOLVED) I think.

Spitfire1
Senior Heliman
Location: Perth Australia

The last few days my hurican has been glitching, every now and then it lurches downward momentarily, yesterday whilst hovering about 10 ft of the deck, the helicopter all of a sudden went into full negative pitch smack into the deck very hard first breaking the undercarriage, then lurched back into the air about 10 ft at what i would say to be full collective, the helicopter then began to do a chaos manouver all by itselfe before destroying itself on the ground, the heli continued to smash itself to peices for atleast a minute on the ground because I couldent kill the throttle, when it finally stopped the motor was still fighting against the clutch but it was in its death throws and i was able to pull out the fuel line.
After a nights sleeping on it im now wondering if the first glitch that made it hit the ground caused the blades to strike the tail causing all the carnage, but to me at the time it seemed though the helicopter was doing some pretty awsom 3d manouvers, all be it without any input from me!.. it all happened pretty fast I had to jump for cover at one point, does this sound like static interference? and if so once i build it back up again what should i do? or any other ideas what it could be?.
as i mentioned it was occasionally giving me a fright lurching down a few feet or so in previous flights, but this time it just went completely nuts.

11-12-2007 06:57 AM

Spitfire1
Senior Heliman
Location: Perth Australia

oh also a guy who was there who seen it happen commented that I had my antenna tied to one of my tail boom supports and this could have caused it.

11-12-2007 07:00 AM

RjX of USA
Senior Heliman
Location: IL

Glitching

I think I would have my TX and RX checked out before using either again. Sounds like a radio issue. Might be your antenna routing to, I would check all after getting the radio check out.

Rusty Howard rjxofusa@myway.com

11-12-2007 07:27 AM

Spitfire1
Senior Heliman
Location: Perth Australia

thanks for the reply, I think its more likely rx or tx related, I noticed my throttle servo was twitching so i changed it thinking it was just a bad servo, definately be doing a range check next time, allthough it was only hovering 3 metres in front of me anyway.

11-12-2007 07:40 AM

Spitfire1
Senior Heliman
Location: Perth Australia

if anyone happens to read this, been reading the post before this, does this mean that I can rule out completely the possibillity of static problems being that my frame is not carbon fibre and is the black g10 type?

11-12-2007 07:55 AM

ammo
Senior Heliman
Location: Singapore

G10 has very little problems with producing glitches.
A common cause of vibration which is very much overlooked is a loose screw in a metal part, the rattling can generate a heap of interferences, effectively locking out even the pcm units with ease.

From your description, it sounds pretty much like a radio or rx problem, eg loose/dying crystal?

11-12-2007 11:23 AM

SteveH
rrProfessor
Location: Texas

FWIW, I agree with Ammo and Rusty. I would definately send the radio, with the switch harness and battery, in to the service center for check-out. Then, when repairing the heli, double check all fasteners to make sure they are tight, especially the ones that have any metal to metal contact. Also, check all the bearings while you are rebuilding the heli, including the engine bearings.

It's not always 100% possible, but you want the antenna routed so that it is not in close proximity to any other electronics (especially servos and gyro), and such that it is not close to any other conductive materials.

SteveH
Magnum Fuel
AMA76186

11-12-2007 01:46 PM

helicrasher
Senior Heliman
Location: Belgium

Hoi,

Seen more then one heli went down because of antennewire broke, just where it go into the recieverbox.
It's not visible because the cover of the wire is still intact.

greetings
Mario

11-12-2007 02:19 PM

Nasscar][
Veteran
Location: Newark, Delaware

For the investment. 2.4ghz is the way to go.

Nas,

11-12-2007 02:20 PM

HOMEPAGE

helicrasher
Senior Heliman
Location: Belgium

Yes, indeed will solve a lot of problems

For now, here in Belgium, it's still not permitted

I think the governer people are a little retarded

Mario

11-12-2007 02:28 PM

jal250r
Veteran
Location: Mankato, MN, US

This same thing happened to a flying friend this summer. As he would begin to idel up it would start to change pitch and idel curves. And other weird things. So we started to pick apart the problem. He collapsed his ant. and starting walking away didnt get 20 yds and it lost signal. His rx had slowly started to give out. Just an idea..

11-13-2007 12:36 AM

Spitfire1
Senior Heliman
Location: Perth Australia

rebuilt but still bad.

I have just got my hurrican rebuilt after the crash and the problems still there.
put in new receiver, moved gyro to back and checked all wires, switch ,batttery connection. etc.
without the motor running everything is perfect, no range problems.
But as soon as the engine is running the throttle servo starts to twich, I know this is a pre curser to a catastrophic los of controll that happened before, can anyone say if my following logic is correct or incorrect?

1, no glitching or range problems while engine not running:
Transmitter not the problem?

2, new receiver:
Receiver not the problem.

3, antenna is not attached to anything except the plastic:
should not be the problem?
any suggestions?.
I read about bearings causing interference, but surely I cant replace every single moving part on the entire helicopter just to eliminate the problem. does anyone know if 2.4 radios will eliminate the prob, i would hate to buy one and find that its exactly the same, this is frustrating because I cant risk flying whilst theres any twitching of the servo at all because ive seen what can happen.

12-04-2007 04:53 AM

RjX of USA
Senior Heliman
Location: IL

Spitfire1

If you have had the trasmitter and reciever changed out and still have the same problem thats good, now you know the chance of them being the problem is less.
Next I would look at bearings, you are right...... I have had to change out most of the bearings before I found the bad one. It should be regular maintence to check your bearing for looseness every so often. Anyway.
Is there a static condition with the G-10 frames? We have not had any reports to date of this.

So I would have to say "No" Please keep us posted on the out come.

Rusty Howard rjxofusa@myway.com

12-04-2007 05:30 AM

ez2bgman
Elite Veteran
Location: N'awlins, LA

Quote
without the motor running everything is perfect, no range problems. But as soon as the engine is running the throttle servo starts to twich

This sounds like a clear indication that the bearings have gone bad in your engine. I would replace your engine bearings with a new set ASAP. You can find them for about $30-$40 USD.

Gary
RJX of USA
Magnum Fuels
SwitchGlo
>Hot Girlz in da gallery<

12-04-2007 06:16 AM

HOMEPAGE

buzzsaw
Key Veteran
Location: Southeast Louisiana

Been there and done this,Replace main shaft bearings and went all spectrum.Problem gone.I agree with Gary,(ez2bgman)motor bearings very well can be the cause.It's ironic though before I changed out My main shaft bearings,I went to spectrum and no static at all,I still had to change the bearings though.I love My spectrum.I would rather have a bearing fail and still have a chance to get it down saftly rather that the bearing tell My hi end pcm to lock out or go crazy any day,This is just My opinion.

12-04-2007 01:32 PM

Nasscar][
Veteran
Location: Newark, Delaware

One more thing,

In the past I have had problems with old and new servos that imposed glitching problem.

One method that I used to identify If I had any bad servos is use some sort of vibration while moving the servo with the tx.

This vibration test alone has saved me $$$ with testing new servos.

Nas,

12-04-2007 10:49 PM

HOMEPAGE

Rockohaulic
Elite Veteran
Location: Valencia, CA, USA, 3rd Rock from the Sun

What kind of receiver are you using?

Did you send it in for a checkout and vibe test?

The reason that I ask is this: I had a similar issue with a 450. Yea I know it's a small electric but hear me out. Everything worked great - no glitches - on the bench. But when I put it into a hover, it went crazy. Serious glitching. Did all kinds of troubleshooting including ripping out all the electronics and laying them out on the table and checking them out.

Then we finally found it. When I touched or moved the RX, the servos twitched. Turns out there was a short inside. When sitting still, all was OK, but once it was vibrated, it started glitching. So when I took off into a hover it started glitching, and then the glitching caused it to vibrate the RX more and the glitching increased. This whole thing escalated into a vibrating nightmare.

Just thinking that if your RX is similar, then when starting the motor the vibrations might be doing the same thing.

I agree with the others that for a nitro, bad bearing are probably the most common cause, but if you eliminate that, then check out your RX!

I got a helicopter for my girlfriend,
It was a good trade!

12-04-2007 11:16 PM

GyroFreak
Key Veteran
Location: Florida ... 28° 50' N 81° 16' W

If your battery to recv wiring is long, try plugging the battery directly into recv. I had a problem when the digital servos came on they yanked the power down on the recv and it couldn't initialize. Not likely your problem but easy check to do.
.

Support bacteria. They're the only culture some people have. !

12-04-2007 11:28 PM

Spitfire1
Senior Heliman
Location: Perth Australia

Thanks for all the advice everyone, sounds like engine bearings a big thing, but strangely it was a new motor not even barely run in.
I think what ill try first is to borrow my one of my dads 2.4 receivers, use his radio and see what happens (very cautiously) if not will continue on to bearings, also ill take receiver to shop to get vib tested.
Should put in a quick word for my dad since this is actually his account im posting on, we both fly hurricans, unfortunately hes just gone to hospital with lung cancer and also in the brain and its not looking to good right now, anyhow thanks for all the good advise I cant wait to get flying again, been grounded for months now.

12-05-2007 04:38 AM

Spitfire1
Senior Heliman
Location: Perth Australia

oh yeah just remembered, sometimes on starting the engine runs for a couple of seconds or so and the goes into reverse disengageing the clutch, Im thinking its the twitching throttle servo causing it but maybe another clue.

12-05-2007 04:51 AM

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RJX Hobby Hurrican 50 - Xtreme 50 > servo problems (NOW SOLVED) I think.

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