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Modefo's RC Helicopters . XHELI.COM . Autography FlightPower

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Synergy R/C Synergy N9 > I agree with Droid...
 
 
ehn
Senior Heliman
Location: Fairfax Station, VA

Heliman, one other thing that Shawgl pointed out and I think is important. There have been THOUSANDS of Synergy flights (let's say 200 out there, 20 flights per, = 4,000. Maybe even close to 10,000). If there was a design failure shouldn't there be more incidences of TT problems??? There is only one that I know of (Droid), although someone else mentioned three). Shouldn't there be at least dozens of failures by now???

Long Island Eric
09-19-2006 05:09 PM
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

You are still around then, how many flights has a 747 done?

How many crashes?


And lets sideline a mo 401 gyro, i've never had a failure doesn't mean i don't believe they fail.

Hope no-one gives you the cure for cancer you'll throw it in the bin.

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-19-2006 05:22 PM
 
 
P.J.
Veteran
Location: Ireland

Droid,

You will soon be a Veteran.

Its time to let the dust settle, if you a right about the TT failing in flight we are going to see alot more posts about TT failures, then you can say i told you so.
But if we don't hear of any TT failing well you will have to eat your words.

P.J.

Mikado Helicopters
Flightpower
Spektrum RC
Curtis Youngblood.com
Scorpion Systems
09-19-2006 08:07 PM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

How many have modified/ checked their TT because of my post?

Hopefully we will never see another TT failure for that reason.
And i was never looking for a medal.

Like i've said before i was only trying to raise awareness not rubbish the design, i love my synergy it has improved my flying, just a shame i'm still waiting for parts!


I've modified and fettled were others had raised issues and left well alone when i did not agree, but i have never continually rubbished individuals like some have on here. When i've been wrong i have apologised which is more than i can say for most.


I'm still a long way off a veteran but this model has taken me from new heliman to senior heliman!!

I closed the TT post but others felt it a valid thread to leave open,so they started it up, i'll still continue to contribute where i can, if nothing else my typing skills will improve

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-19-2006 08:43 PM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

..
09-19-2006 09:29 PM
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

Quote-I think everyone here wants to know if there are issues to be looked at but if you approached it in a different way it may have been handled in a different way. Something like....well I rang up Synergy or my local rep with a list of concerns and the company gave great service, was concerned with the issues and resolved them as soon as they could. If the issues were then discussed and a note saying the company was looking into them with fixes for those concerned the problems could have been seen for what they are...an initial bunch of teething problems that are solvable.-Unquote

Ok so i gave a bad analogy maybe i can't compare it to a 747 what i'm trying to put across is that my instance and possibly others, unconfirmed perhaps, should not happen again as most have checked and will continue to keep an eye on the TT.

If i refer back to my initial post in Kit gripes so far..


1.Ball links seem under size
2.Boom supports inadequate, i've added a K&S strut clamp, makes it a little more rigid
3.Why put the fuel vent on the right side when the muffler is on the left, and as for that fitting....
4.Brass sleeve in tail kit (7mm) needs moving to anti rotation kit and vice versa (5mm)
5.NO ANTENNA TUBE
6.a.Washout arms hit swash at extremes !! (trim outer hole off)
6.b.Make them out of metal!
7.Servo mount screws really should be next size up i have bigger in my trex!!
8.Clutch lining not thick enough, excessive gap necessitating high engine rpms to engage (and eventual clutch breakage),could also do with a shim under clutch for shoe to hub clearance.
9.Ditch the collet fan hub make one like quick UK do for the rappies that screw on the crank thread!!
10.Clutch bell distorted (in my kit anyway)

Hands up who had 1,4,6,8,9!

I phoned our uk rep over this and the only ISSUE i had at that time was ball links to which the reply was they are being worked on, the rest were gripes that i had personally with the kit all fixed for little or no outlay.
I have since had the one way bearing slip in housing and finally the TT fail, i have never bitched on about dialing in the fan hub because mine was spot on, i think i've put up with my fair share of grief here and like i said before paid for the priviledge to say what i want, yes probably prematurely but i was frustrated and very annoyed!
I have spoken since to the uk rep about my TT incident and he confirmed that there have been no instances recorded, did i expect any different no, however he was sympathetic and i'm still waiting for bits as supply has been lacking or is it just spares have sold out (supply and demand) Bob would confirm this.

I have since tried to contact the US division of synergy RC and still no answer.......

Most of the quotes you listed have been taken out of the context where i was trying to defend myself against an onslaught of synergy RC police
I still maintain that this kit is overpriced for what it is now, and do not dispute that when it is sorted would be worthy of that price tag, lets not forget we are paying premium prices here in the UK. Yes the problems are solvable but how long is it going to take??

The bottom line is ball links are not new they at least should have been right in the first place.

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-19-2006 10:36 PM
 
 
Brett
Veteran
Location: Chicago Burbs

I friend of mine is building one and the links are excellent, in fact he has not had any major problems other than a issue with the TT and the customer service he said was great. Whats the variable here????
09-20-2006 02:38 AM
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

Droid, Very well written post man. If I were the chief of the synergy R/C police I would get a warrant and confiscate your heli for evidence. Then I would get busted for taking evidence for my own use.

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-20-2006 05:39 AM
 
 
heliman
Senior Heliman
Location: Fullerton, CA

A guy at our field has an N9 and he takes lessons from Todd B. I asked him why he trimmed the washout arms. He replied that Todd told him to trim the arms because they could interact with the swash or anti-rotation, I don't remember which. The arms have 2 holes but you have to cut one off! That doesn't make much sense. That second hole is the only adjustment (not talking about dampers) you can make to the head.
I would have liked to see more adjustability to the head.

I'm sure the kit will be awesome when they get the bugs worked out of it.

Heads up Augusto, the Aurora is the next heli we get to pick apart.
09-20-2006 06:01 AM
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

You still have adjustment on the flybar seesaw

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-20-2006 07:48 PM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

..
09-20-2006 09:43 PM
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

Looking at the abovementioned model i think its safe to say that the kit will be being sold cheaper than the collective sum of parts and they will make their money back on repair parts.

The parts count on my crash which looked horrific at first (they always do) was surprising to say the least, no heli is gonna be cheap to crash but when all is said and done the performance of this machine + crash costs + looks make it the better of the 2 in my opinion.


I'm sure i just thought all those words but they magically appeared on the screen!!

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-21-2006 01:19 AM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

..
09-21-2006 03:10 AM
 
 
Augusto
rrAdvertiser
Location: San Diego, CA

daddiesyacht posted

Quote 
Someone made a comment here on plastic arms should be made out of metal on a class of this machine yet no one and I mean no one has commented on the Aurora site of the plastic washout arms on the Aurora. (at least thats what they look like in the pics) Thats because plastic arms have been around for ages and do the job just fine. Aurora kit price is same but no paddles or tail blades. Synergy gives you fine SAB paddles and blades. Thats 60 or 70 bucks.

Also a couple of price comparisons for parts. Avant parts as no Aurora parts yet.

Canopy $80 Synergy $69

1 frame half $65 Synergy $36

Main shaft $27 Synergy $16

Flybar $15 Synergy $10

Blade grip $49 Synergy $15 (plus bearing)



Thats all I could really compare at this stage but unless CX is going to reduce the avant parts prices I wouldn't imagine the Aurora parts will be cheaper.

The parts prices are pretty competitive considering the above comparisons of a few main items.



daddiesyacht,

I think you should wait until the Aurora spare price list is out to make comparisons. Comparisons at this point are based on speculation.

Also if you're going to compare prices you should be fair and give all the information on what you're comparing.

For instance if you're going to compare bladegrips you should compare them like this:

Avant:
CNC Machined metal bladegrip with two bearings $49.00

Synergy:
Plastic bladegrip #120-112 including #108-816 Bearings $33.00($15.00+18.00)

You should also mention that in a crash the metal bladegrip is unlikely to break and that the pitch arm being a sacrificial part ends up being cheaper than the whole plastic grip.

When comparing frames you should mention that the Avant EFX frames are carbon frames and not G10 and so forth and so on.



We haven't released the prices of our spare parts but here's a preview of a couple of prices that show you how wrong you can be by making comparisons without the right information

Sprag system:

Synergy:
108-151 Sprag Bearing $90.00
110-153 Sprag Outer Race $9.50
110-152 Sprag Inner Race $25.00
108-155 15x24x5 Bearing $15.00
Total: $139.50

Aurora:
Sprag cluth system including sprag clutch, inner race, outer race and radial bearing $39.50


As you can see that's $139.00 against $39.00, that's exactly $100.00 cheaper in a single assembly.


Here's another example:

When you look at main, crown and tail gears here's your comparison:

Synergy:
110-124 Standard Main Gear $50.00
110-145 70T Crown Gear $40.00
115-315 Tail rotor bevel gear $18.00 x 2 = $36.00
Total 4 gears: $126.00

Aurora
99T Main Gear CNC Machined Delrin $29.50
Constant drive gear CNC machined Delrin $28.50
Tail gear $6.95 x 2 = 13.90
Total $71.90

That's $126.00 against $71.90 or over Fifty Four dollars less in the gears alone.


What I just did is called unfair cherry-picking to make my point and it's a misleading practice that nobody should do. There are obviously parts that will be more expensive than the Synergy so at the end of the day both machines will be probably comparable in price to buy and own. I honestly don't know simply because I haven't looked at all the synergy prices because we are still pricing our spares based on our costs and I suppose they did the same.

I dislike having to debate this stuff online but we keep getting bashed by people without any real information to make comparisons.

Our product is not released nor is the spare parts price list so please if possible avoid getting us involved in the discussions until you have enough information to do so.

The part I really don't understand is why a person buying one heli makes himself an immediate enemy of the other person that got the competing heli. It's as if people is so insecure of their own choices that they need to join a bashing party against the competing heli to feel some sort of self assurance that they made the right decision. Even Jason and I keep being good friends and WE are the actual competitors. Becoming instant enemies from a purchase of a toy helicopter is a childish and immature attitude.

My recommendation is buy whatever you like best. If you have a problem try to solve it in a civil manner and avoid getting into online fights over toy helicopters. Go fly whatever machine you have and try to enjoy every minute of it because life is very short and every minute of it that you didn't enjoy is gone forever.

Augusto.

Avant Aurora Ultimate
09-21-2006 03:22 AM
 
 
Cy Paul
Veteran
Location: Toronto, Ontario

OUCH you told him Augusto

Later,
Cy

Helis currently flying =
Aurora,
Synergy N9,
Trex 600,
Trex 450
09-21-2006 03:32 AM
 
 
RCHeliJim
Elite Veteran
Location: Orem, UT USA

Quote 
My recommendation is buy whatever you like best. If you have a problem try to solve it in a civil manner and avoid getting into online fights over toy helicopters. Go fly whatever machine you have and try to enjoy every minute of it because life is very short and every minute of it that you didn't enjoy is gone forever.


Couldnt agree more, and I love the fact that you acknowledge and agree with me that these are just toys - something to gain enjoyment from Rock on man, I may get an Aurora just based on your good attitude!



Go Fly, Have Fun!!
-Team Quick UK
-Team RCHeliMag
09-21-2006 03:32 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Mike Wilson
Veteran
Location: Toronto, Canada

Amen to that

Team Avant
Flightpower
V-blades
Aerospire
Spektrum
Teambob00
09-21-2006 04:01 AM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

..
09-21-2006 04:42 AM
 
 
Augusto
rrAdvertiser
Location: San Diego, CA

Don't worry about it after all they are only toy helis

Augusto.

Avant Aurora Ultimate
09-21-2006 05:05 AM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

..
09-21-2006 05:14 AM
 
 
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Synergy R/C Synergy N9 > I agree with Droid...
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