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Advantage Hobby . Revolution Models . CarbonXtreme

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Synergy R/C Synergy N9 > I agree with Droid...
 
 
heliman
Senior Heliman
Location: Fullerton, CA

On one hand, he should expect to get a kit that has been rid of MAJOR problems.

On the other hand, it's what expected of all helicopters when they are first release (as with most other products).

No product will ever be perfect; however, there are numerous examples from which they could and did take and improve on design elements of existing helis, as nothing about the helicopter is revolutionary.

As an example, there shouldn't be a problem with the following parts from ANY manufacturer:
fan collets (been around for 20+ years)
torque tube (been around for 10-15 years)

The design of the TT is a poor one in my opinion.

I totally applaud their effort and it's an awesome heli, however, I'll probably buy the Aurora or I'll wait until the Synergy V2.
09-16-2006 03:02 AM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

You own one obviously?
Collets have been around for a long time and is a sound concept...quality control is the problem.....it is not a major issue and is not an issue that needed solving prior to launch was it? It simply has been a an issue of manufacture that is being addressed.
Why is the torque tube design that poor? There doesn't seem to be a whole bunch of experienced heli pilots moaning about it on here.
Who's to say Augusto won't have problems on the launch of the Aurora?

What gets me is that there are those that will beat up on something they don't have and are only armed with second hand information. For this reason I only comment on the pro's and con's of heli's I have actually had something to do with.

Why come on here and beat up over situations that have been well covered and are in the process of being sorted? You only make another hurdle for guys trying to produce an awesome 3 D heli to you.

Yes everyone has the right to a bug free heli....just like everyone has the right to bug free microsoft software but some things are beyond peoples contol until the issues can be addressed in good time. If you are not prepared for that I honestly believe you should not get either the synergy or an Aurora. That may have launch problems too. Perhaps go get a fury or tempest or something that has been debugged for a while.
09-16-2006 03:49 AM
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

Funny!!!

I am getting a kick out of this....

I didn't get to chime in on Droids comments on the other thread before it was closed. I met Chuckie, Todd, and Jason among others when I lived in Maryland. Well to say he is meticulous is an understatement. As for why would he be using 95mm tail blades? Quite possibly to suit his flying style. Why go bigger if they are not needed for your Main/tail combination? Oh yea..... you already had your conclusion that the TT couldn't hold it.. I didn't mean to spoil that one for you.

Ask yourself this.... How many times has this happened since the heli has been flying? Out of the thousands of flights these machines have gone through and you have one of the three failures..... Sounds like karma to me. Maybe you shouldn't have mumbled under your breath at your boss when you left a loose bolt on one of those CAT engines at work.

Everyone makes mistakes. Get over it. I work in aviation and I have seen some civilian proffesionals that I wouldn't let work on my lawn mower!!!!! And if you cant get a TT together correctly I'm not sure I would let you work on my heavy equipment either

It sucks that it happened to you, don't get me wrong but I will tell you one thing. Oh yea.... DROID I invite you to come on over where I'm at and tell one of my Marines that my country doesn't take responsability for it's actions. I beg you to do that.

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-16-2006 04:31 AM
 
 
heliman
Senior Heliman
Location: Fullerton, CA

I've owned a lot of different helis and I (again, I) don't like the design of the TT. This should be an absolutely reliable part. There should be NO problems with modern torque tubes. I like their idea of replaceable ends (ala Bergen) but I think that the insert should have been tapped and screwed or pinned.

I'm not saying that there is something inherently wrong with collets; however, Synergy is having a problem, be it QC or bad design. Whatever the issue, the buyer is having a problem. Again, there should not be fan mounting issues on modern helicopter design with all of the examples, good and bad, already on the market.

Quote 
No product will ever be perfect


I fully expect Augusto to have problems with his heli, too.


No, I don't own a Synergy. I haven't made up my mind on which one to buy but I do prefer the design of the Aurora. I've seen both in person and up close.

I said that I'd wait for the Synergy N9 V2 or the Aurora.

Helis I've owned in the past 5 years.
6 - R60/80/90
3 - R50
2 - Fury 60/80
2 - Futura SE
2 - Vigor
2 - MA 99SE
1 - Bergen Intrepid
1 - Predator 90
1 - 3DNT
1 - Sceadu 50
1 - Mercury 60 (Kalt)
1 - Freya 60/80
1 - Evolution 90 (new)
1 - Caliber 5 (not flown yet)
1 - T-Rex 450
1 - T-Rex 600
1 - Venture 30
09-16-2006 04:43 AM
 
 
Freya
Senior Heliman
Location: Seattle, Washington

How many did you actually fly?
09-16-2006 05:21 AM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

But the Aurora may not be perfect out of the box so you may be waiting for a while eh?
09-16-2006 05:28 AM
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

No matter what comes out, someone will always have a problem with it in some way, shape or form. And someone will always have their little touch to add to it to "improve" the design. Me, when I do get my synergy..... I may add some epoxy (EA934) aka JB weld to the ends and call it a day. We'll see. After the beating Nigel Brown put on it in that video I'm sure it wasn't design failure. Sounds like operator error to me. Some people just over engineer everything. And some people deserve a beating for running their mouth about my country.

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-16-2006 06:12 AM
 
 
heliman
Senior Heliman
Location: Fullerton, CA

None of the helis that I've owned were problem-free. However, I repeat, that there shouldn't be any problems with the basics of a modern helicopter. How difficult is that for people to understand?

You don't agree that a TT should be problem-free, or that mounting a fan and clutch assembly shouldn't take 2-3 hours, require special tools, and have to be attempted multiple times?

I expect the Aurora to have problems; however, I hope that they don't have problems with some of the most basic elements of the heli.
09-16-2006 06:21 AM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

for goodness sake heliman it is not hard for us to understand what you are saying. What you are being told is that there is nothing wrong with the designs and yes clutches take some work but the problems come from manufacturing faults and not design faults.....do you think that JK or TB are over there producing the parts themselves??? Do you not think they realise that some parts are not even what they expect them to be or maybe they should have run a batch to find out what was going to be the issues? Perhaps say give them away istead of offering to replace the parts to people like you to test for them? Will you get on here and bleat about the same things should Augusto farm out some parts to be manufactured overseas and have some quality issues that he may need to sort out. I am sure he would love to be able to say there will be no issues but I reckon that would be a big call.

Give them a chance to sort out the issues in good time before public slaying.....Don't tell everyone here.....join their site and discuss your problems direct with them!! (oh hang on...you don't even have a synergy!)
09-16-2006 07:56 AM
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

A couple thousand flights on that TT design and you have three or four failures..... It's NOT a design problem. IT'S BAD LUCK!!!!!!! 15,000 flight hours here in Iraq and we balled up a perfectly good Cobra into a freakin lake!!!! Killed two Marines. Imagine that sh!t!!! A desert the size of Cali and we hit a damn lake!!!! Is it Bell Helicopters problem? F%&K NO!!! It's bad luck. Special tools to get a collet on and dial indicate a fan hub.....Heck.... you could have just as easily bolted the fan on and then complained about your vibration problems. Surprised you didn't do that also. You want vibration problems, go look at the stratus forum!! Oh, snap!!! You don't even own a Synergy!!! Neither do I... YET!!! I own a Fury Extreme that I can't wait to get home too it!!

Remember one thing...... SH!T breaks, like it or not, sooner or later it's going to happen to you.


TOOL

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-16-2006 08:28 AM
 
 
HATORI
Heliman
Location: uk

what gets me is out of all the synergys sold world wide so far and only a handfull have got minor problems from the first release you will get that in any new product
before giving them a beating you have to realise its is a brand new design from the ground up the aurora will be along the same lines as the avant which was designed around a freya an already proven heli
would the avant have the same problems if it was designed from scratch instead of being a really expensive upgrade on an heli that has been around for years
so guys give it a rest beating up on jason and todd they have done a fantastic job with the N9 and hope they make a 50 size

also yes i do have a synergy no i didnt have too dial in the fan was spot on with the ys91st4 no vibrations chromed linkage balls are on the way and so far touch wood no failures but i know its going in at some point but hey i could always blame something on the heli rather than pilot error
09-16-2006 08:32 AM
 
 
falcon
Key Veteran
Location: Peterborough UK

I realy want a Synergy but now ???
Quote 
I totally applaud their effort and it's an awesome heli, however, I'll probably buy the Aurora or I'll wait until the Synergy V2.


I think i will wait

Trex600E,Trex600N-Pro+ KASAMA SRIMOK Rotor head,Trex450se, R50 Kasamas
09-16-2006 08:46 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

Amen, Even the heli's that have been out for years still have the occasional problem. There is NO WAY to prevent all failures. A couple incidents don't necesarilly point to a failure of design. I would chalk it up as bad luck and move on. I tell you there is a stratus vibration problem on that forum EVERY DAY. M/A doesn't get half the flak Jason and Todd are getting.

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-16-2006 08:49 AM
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

Falcon....

Go to the synergy site, the collets are already changed to a slotted design. The TT is a non issue. Bad luck, nothing more. The support is nothing less than phenominal. PM yugi about that...... Get your synergy man. If that is what you want. Life is what you make of it. Some people will always b!tch. They will even make it up if needed.

Greg

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-16-2006 08:52 AM
 
 
HATORI
Heliman
Location: uk

yo falcon ask droid if he will sell his cheap
09-16-2006 08:54 AM
 
 
falcon
Key Veteran
Location: Peterborough UK

canopycreations

LOL

Trex600E,Trex600N-Pro+ KASAMA SRIMOK Rotor head,Trex450se, R50 Kasamas
09-16-2006 08:58 AM
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

That is a good idea!!! I would go back to the original tq tube configuration though. Just to fly the snot out of it and prove him wrong. I'll give $500 for it right now.

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-16-2006 09:02 AM
 
 
Helinutnz
Elite Veteran
Location: below 42 South

Hey Heliman....I fly 767's for a living and one of our engines launched itself a while ago on climbout. Our company has a fantastic safety and maintainence record and due to the correct actions by the crew the plane was flown to a safe landing. Now under your rules perhaps the engine manufacturer is to blame. Surely they could have sorted out their engines so they don't go bang by now.....hell there has only been millions of flight hours on these power plants. In fact engine and aircraft manufacturers are continually advising AD's (which in laymans terms are modifications to rectify known problems) and some of these AD's years and years after the first manufacture. They have even been hit with ....guess what......faulty parts manufacture!

So I reckon those that don't want one....guess what......you are not required to buy one and secondly and more importantly give up the public bashing and see if these SMALL issues are sorted out soon. you can bet they are working hard on any issues people have.

Oh and further more....I have an evo 50 where there is no collets and virtually no way to correct out of true fan hub conditions yet I still had to shave material off the inside of the hub to true it up and get it running better. Yes that required special tools and if you dont have them you should get them. These are not bolt together and fly machines.....they require some mechanical knowledge and skill.
09-16-2006 09:15 AM
 
 
shawgl
Key Veteran
Location: Sunny San Diego! Finally!!!

That is what I'm talking about!!! Preach it brother.

In God we trust, everyone else we monitor.
09-16-2006 09:25 AM
 
 
Droid
Elite Veteran
Location: Deep down in the Southwest- UK

Chromed linkage balls are on their way!

Hmm funny that when i spoke to the distributor they are still having problems getting the tolerance, its no problem i'd rather they took the time and get it right. I fixed my slop and the machine was excellent, not that i could tell the difference of course!

Shawgl, if you wan't to pay $500 for a pile of scrap at the moment i would say you have more money than sense, tell you what i'll take the motor and servos out get it repaired and i'll offer it to you at 20% of the UK RRP that'll be $1053 at todays rate

Quotes may have been changed for my own amusement
09-16-2006 11:24 AM
 
 
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Midland Helicopters . HeliProz . ZoomsHobbies

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Synergy R/C Synergy N9 > I agree with Droid...
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