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Model Rectifier Corp . 3D Heli Depot . JR-Spektrum

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Audacity Models Pantera 50 - Tiger 50 > NEWBIE
 
 
flyer2k5
Heliman
Location: Augusta Georgia

Hello forum
I am currently learning to fly a Blade CP! I will be purchasing a tiger 50 and all the equipment in the next few weeks. This is the setup I plan on using, if anyone have any suggestions please let me know before I purchase the equipment! Thanks


Tiger 50
O.S 50 ( non hyper)
gyro 401w/servo
Futaba T7chp w/servos/rx
Starter carry case kit (Heliproz)


What hand tools will I need to assemble this monster! Is there a kit with all tools I need like blade balancer ETC. Thanks What price range did you guys spend putting these together.
11-15-2005 Over year old.
 
 
sp1nm0nkey
Senior Heliman
Location: Redwood City, CA

You'll need some hex wrenches and screw drivers, nothing too special. Make sure you lok-tite EVERYTHING where metal touches metal. Blade balancing isn't too hard without a balancer, just use two glasses next to each other, and screw the blades together. For dynamic balancing, put a razor blade in a vice and balance each blade with that. By the way, you'll spend a ton less if you buy used. Have fun! Nitro is a totally different world.
11-15-2005 Over year old.
 
 
darkfa8
Key Veteran
Location: Eatontown, NJ, USA

you can get a idea on what you need by downloading and looking at the manual at audacitymodels.com

some of the specialized stuff you should have is a dial indicator and stand with a vise or some means of holding the motor so you can check and adjust the run-out on the clutch hub/clutch/start shaft assembly. Doing this will insure the least amount of vibration from the motor output.

i'm not sure what your's budget it, but when I started in the hobby I tried to get away with cheap tools and starting gear, and well, most of it is crap.

i bought a Sullivan Dynatron, last starter i'll ever have to buy.

A Robbe one-way 6mm starter extension, high quality, doesn't round the tip off.

Century curved ball-link pliers. These are really nice, nice handles, curved duck-bill type pliers that can get into tight places...like on the Tiger, and are inexpensive.

Hudy profiTools allen drivers, 3, 2.5, 2, 1.5mm sizes, www.hudy.net These are about the best drivers you can get and have larger handles compaired to the comparable MIP Thorpe drivers. Team Losi also makes a set of allen drivers that appear to be very well made. High quality allen drivers are one of the best invests you can make in this hobby. You will use them A LOT and the cheapo ones will strip the driver and/or the screw you're working with. I have used Bondhus, Whia, Craftsman, Snap-On... The Hudy tools were for me. I do own a set of WHia ball-end drivers, BUT I only use these for quick removal or initial installation of screws and I do final torquing with the Hudys.

A Hone Depot line level for putting on the fly-bar to set it level and then check your pitch readings on your main blade pitch guage.

You'll have to select a battery technology for the receiver. I personally use a Sanyo CP-2400SCR 6vdc pack from cheapbatterypacks.com (i think that's where I got it) and a 2300mAH NiMH transmitter pack. The batteries that come with the 7CHP radio system are worthless in the heli world. You're better off buying higher capacity batteries and selling off the stock Futaba batteries to some plankers on Ebay, that's what I did.

I stuck with the NiCD/NiMH packs because I only use one charger that charges both at the same time, a Sirius Pro. They are durable, can take high charge and discharge rates, are cheap, no really safety concerns to worry about (like Lipos) and the Tiger needs quite a bit of weight up in the nose to properly balance it. So, at 285grams, my pack does a good job of that.

You'll also want a blade balancer, a good one that is pretty prevalent and reliable is the KSJ balancer, not the new one which is red, but the older one that has clear sides and a black cradle. This will allow you to balance your main blades properly. If you know someone who flies helis, maybe you could borrow it when you build yours. I did that for a while until I eventually bought mine used on Ebay with a bunch of other rc tools that I turned around and sold off.

With the 7CH radio, if you can afford it, get the one with the digital servos (s3151). They will be better suited to the Tiger then the cheaper analog servos. The digitals are more accurate, hold center position better and are better suited to the eCCPM mixing setup on the Tiger.

Get yourself a large hula-hoop and some 1/2" or so wooden dowls (crafts store) and make yourself some training gear if you haven't flown a heli like this before. Once you can land in a controlled and soft manner, every time, then you can ditch the hula-hoop. It is cheap, it provides 360* of roll-over protection and if it's gonna go over it gives you more time to react to correct...also, it won't fold up on you like them stupid sticks and whiffle ball things. The RotoPod is a waste of money. Spend $5 on the hula-hoop setup and the rest of the money you saved on fuel.

A good fuel pump system. I'm not sure what are the good electric pumps, but I hate my manual pump It's just junk.. but I do like the billet aluminum Slimline M4 cap/fueler system I'm using.. I just need to find a better pump.

Anyhow, I'll guesstimate that I've prolly spent over $400 on tools, batteries, charger and other assorted specialized stuff. It pays to buy quality stuff in the begining, even if it takes longer to get it all together. Good tools and equipment just make other things a lot easier. Also, if you do decide to bail on the hobby, they typically have a high resale value.

- Dan G. -
11-15-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ARMSMASTER
Veteran
Location: spokane, wa

Darkfa8,
As to the electric fuel pump I would suggest the one from Sullivan it is called the Sullivan Streamer model #s752. I think I paid around $20.00 for it. It is yellow in color and I have never had to prime it like some of the other cheaper electric fuel pumps that I have used over the years. It has high volume pumping ability and works great. I hope this helps.
flyer2k5
Drakfa8 gave you a great list of stuff. I think you should also make sure you get a good quality pitch gauge. Many other tools were mentioned but no mentioned the pitch gauge. I think you should also invest in a flight simm just to help out. Not knowing where your flying ability is at. The simm is a great way to get some orientation practice down at a cheap price. I am sure several additional rr members will throw in their two cents worth. I wish you luck and I know you will come to love the tiger.

Thanks,
Perry

Caution or the Earth will Swallow you Up!
11-15-2005 Over year old.
 
 
darkfa8
Key Veteran
Location: Eatontown, NJ, USA

Thanks for the info Perry. Obviously I'm already happy with my Dynatron, so another Sullivan product would be nice.

I use a Robart pitch gauge (10/-10) for the majority of my setup. When I'm trying to pull +12 for my throttle hold, I'll use a Mavrick plastic gauge that goes to 15/-15. Miniature Aircraft makes a very good pitch gauge, though the Mavrick is a cheaper copy.

What I'd like to get is a better fly-bar locking tool. Rick's has one that is a world better then the flimsy, crappy one that comes with the Robart guage... that way I won't have to play games keeping the fly-bar level, trying to read my pitch gauge and operate the radio at the same time, ugh =\

- Dan G. -
11-15-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
darkfa8
Key Veteran
Location: Eatontown, NJ, USA

less then $15, plus shipping of course

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bi...752&FVPROFIL=++

- Dan G. -
11-15-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ARMSMASTER
Veteran
Location: spokane, wa

Dan,
Glad to hear that you like the suggestion for the fuel pump. I also use the Robart pitch gauge. For the flybar I use either the crappy stock one or I have one from century. It solidly locks the flybar. In fact it works so well it is almost a pain. It is real tight. Also I try not to use Tower hobbies for any of my purchases. First of all I work at our local hobby store. The other reason is that I like to support the local businesses first. I know that there is all sorts of arguments against shipping costs-vs-sales tax. One of my beef's against tower is that they are just a back door retail outlet for Great Planes. They sell stuff for less than their national price and sometimes less than the dealer cost. This sounds great for the consumer, but terrible for the local hobby dealer. With the increased number of local hobby stores closing their doors every year, it will not be long before most local stores are gone. I think that if more modelers got behind their local stores and made their purchases their, instead of at the mail order houses than the world would be a better place for all modelers. Well, enough of my soap box. Good luck on your fuel pump.

Sincerely,
Perry

Caution or the Earth will Swallow you Up!
11-15-2005 Over year old.
 
 
Learn to Fly
Key Veteran
Location: Yalesville Connecticut

For a few bucks more get the Hyper 50...its worth every penny.

Good tool are a must. I had cheap hex drivers made by Integy. They would round out in a heart beat. Now I have MIP Thorpe drivers...one word, sweet. I had a stripped out head on a screw that the Integy wrench would not back out, nor an L shaped wrench. Put the MIP on it and it backed out no problem. Mip will recut the tips when they wear down for a few bucks.

DarkFa8 pretty much said it all. Dan the Man!!!!!!!!

I have some training gear I will give you if you pay shipping. its the Audacity gear...

Another tool is the ball end tool. it helps screw ball ends on linkage. Forgot what its called...( gimble??)

Have fun this is a great hobby. You will find Most are willing to help.

I have been flying a couple of months and just did my first flips, loops, rolls, piros, this weekend. I do believe its cause my Tiger was set up perfectly this time( it will fly hands of for a while), and I took my time learning orrentations. It is a SMOOTH machine. Ok and G3 helped out ALOT!!!

Plus a box stock Tiger will flip, loop and more..


******I buy nothing online...I have a great hobby shop. I cant get help from the online guy, plus I like hanging out at the hobby shop and shooting the bull with others.*****RC Hobbies and More, Winsted Ct. they have expanded, and have LOTS of kits and parts and tools. Check them out sometime.


Jeff
Believe nothing you hear, and half of what you see...
11-15-2005 Over year old.
 
 
flyer2k5
Heliman
Location: Augusta Georgia

Thanks for the Info!!!!!!! Whats the difference in the O.S. 50 hyper? Will it be needed or will I know the difference being A newbie? Thanks
11-15-2005 Over year old.
 
 
Herc
Key Veteran
Location: Cranbrook, BC - Canada

flyer2k5

Welcome! I'm a newbie to the Tiger too so I'm going to watch this thread.

I've managed to get just about everything I need for the Tiger off of RR's Classified section over the last few days. Including the Tiger. I've gotten: Rx, cyclic & collective servos, GY401 & 9254, and a GEM2000. The only things left, I think, are field starting eqpt, receiver pack, base loaded ant and a motor. I am going to get a OS 50 Hyper and I will buy that new.

This has turned out to be a lot cheaper than I thought (buying used). As long as everything works as advertised I'll be happy. A lot cheaper than setting up and flying my TRex.

Herc
11-15-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ManuelCJr1
Senior Heliman
Location: Sun City, Arizona

You probably won't notice the difference being new. But if you buy the os 50 hyper there is no reason for you to buy another motor later because you need more power. Some people like to start off w/11-011 for pitch. but i think for a beginner it would be better to start with -3-0-9 It will make the heli seem less pitchy on the stick cause it only has 12 total degrees for the whole stick instead of 22. It is preference though. But definatly the hyper head. it will take you from begginer to 3d. A governer would also help smooth out the power all way round
11-15-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
flyer2k5
Heliman
Location: Augusta Georgia

Thanks Manuel

What exactly is the job of the governer? Also, can some one explain this co-pilot gadget? Thanks
11-15-2005 Over year old.
 
 
darkfa8
Key Veteran
Location: Eatontown, NJ, USA

the govenor is a electronic device that takes a reading of engine rpm with either a magnetic or optical sensor that is attached to the engine mount, a magnet or optical tape is put in the underside of the fan and it can govern the amount of engine rpm with the throttle servo independantly of collective pitch.

It's like cruise control for your main rotor. It allows you to set a constant rpm/headspeed and the governor will control the throttle to insure that that rpm is maintained throughout a flight.

However, this can also be achieved, much more inexpensively by properly setting up your pitch and throttle curves. If you have the money and the time, by all means get a governor. However, it's not necessary and adding more electronics that aren't an immeadiate need on a heli for a novice isn't something I'd recommend until after you have a better understanding of your heli and how it flies.

As for the Co-Pilot, I have one on my Tiger. What it is is a replacement receiver, a horizontal infrared sensor and a vertical infrared sensor. Once everything is mounted and setup properly when you activate Flight Stabilization, the Co-Pilot system will automatically level out the heli upright even if it's in a inverted position. Depending on how you set the percentage of correction (0-100%) will determine how much authority your controls have over the Co-Pilot system.

Also, it has a Fail Safe option you can set so if your radio battery dies or your frequency gets blocked or for whatever reason the receiver loses it's signal from the transmitter you can set up the heli to correct itself. Once radio contact is reaquired all controls resume to normal.

I have mine set at 100% Flight Stabilization controlled on a on/Off Switch on my Tx and my Fail Safe is set so the Flight Stabilization is on 100%, the pitch goes to 0*. This would put the heli into a stabilized, level, gradual decent.

I paid $175 for mine privately and it's saved me more then that in potential crash damage costs. I use it as a bail-out. I figure if I lose control for whatever reason I'd like to give the technology a chance to save my heli from as much damage as possible if possible and/or to give me extra time to try and regain control.

- Dan G. -
11-15-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ManuelCJr1
Senior Heliman
Location: Sun City, Arizona

I was thinking about getting one of those. But the guys tease me that i wouldn't be flying it would be the co- pilot. But i think it sounds like a worth while investment. And you said you can turn it on and off so i'll have to look into that
11-16-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
jvanscoyk
Veteran
Location: Tucson, AZ

A local guy here users a Co-Pilot on a Raptor 50 that he has set up as a camera ship.
It helps him keep the ship level and stable as he is taking pictures.

Jim

must go faster, must go faster.........
11-16-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
flyer2k5
Heliman
Location: Augusta Georgia

Thanks guys for all your input!!!!!!!!!

Ok , if I get a 8ch or 9ch tx from futaba, what servos and reciever should I be looking for? I have seen a Futaba 9CHPS SUPER 9 CH PCM RADIO AIRPLANE HELICOPTER around $290 is this agood deal? Thanks (radio only)
11-16-2005 Over year old.
 
 
jvanscoyk
Veteran
Location: Tucson, AZ

I have JR equipment so I can't speak too much about Futaba but I know that the switch placement on the heli version of the JR transmitters is taylored towards heli flyers. I have a airplanes and a 8103 radio which will fly helis but the switch placement is wrong.
Be sure that whatever radio you get that the switches are in the right locations or are assignable.

Jim

must go faster, must go faster.........
11-16-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
ManuelCJr1
Senior Heliman
Location: Sun City, Arizona

i have a futaba 9c and it's great. it is really user freindly. The screens are very helpfull and i think make it easy to set up throttle and pitch curves. I am using 9252's on the cyclic. it makes the heli really responsive.
11-16-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
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