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Futaba-RC . A Main Hobbies . Boca Bearings

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e-E-Flite Blade CP mCX CX 400-3D > Blade Trainer Cord?
 
 
rob_jones
Key Veteran
Location: Oglethorpe, GA

Does anybody know what kind of trainer cord works with the new Blade e-heli? There are a couple of them at my field and I though it'd be nice to use them on a buddy box system. The connector on the back of the transmitter is like nothing I've ever seen. The local hobby shop has 5 or 6 different types of trainer cords, but none of them are even similar to the Blade.

It almost looks like an S-Video plug.

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Team MRC Hirobo
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
06-23-2005 Over year old.
 
 
ImRich
Veteran
Location: Derry, NH USA

I've started spec'ing out a training cord but I haven't built one yet.

There is a rumor that the training function is disabled in the transmitter, but I haven't tested it yet.

The connector looks similar to an S-Video connector, so I may try to modify a cable to see if I can get it to work.

Don't simply try an S-Video cable, that won't work even if the connectors fit. Two signals have to be reversed (data stream in and out) for the training function to work properly.

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Rich
06-23-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rob_jones
Key Veteran
Location: Oglethorpe, GA

Why would the trainer function be disabled if it has a trainer switch and plug on the transmitter?

The thought of trying an S-Video cable did occur to me. But I figured it'd be way smarter to just get the right kind of cable and not do something stupid!

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Team MRC Hirobo
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
06-23-2005 Over year old.
 
 
jschenck
Elite Veteran
Location: La Vista, NE.

Esky trainer cable might work

Since the radio appears to be the exact same (except Esky has added a whiz-bang LCD panel)

Heli-Fever Esky traniner chord link


...yep...
06-24-2005 Over year old.
 
 
ImRich
Veteran
Location: Derry, NH USA

I don't know why it would be disabled, but that was what someone from Horizon said in an email.

Here is what I found in my analysis so far.

Sorry, no diagrams yet!

Looking at the back of the transmiter, with the antenna pointing up there are four pins which go into the 's-video' like connector.

The two lower pins are closer together than the two top pins

Let's number them in a clock-wise fashon starting from the bottom left hand corner (say 7pm) and call this pin 1 (this is just an arbitrary pin numbering scheme).

So the pins should look like this:

Code 

2 3

1 4



Pin 1 is the data stream signal input
Pin 2 is the data stream signal output
Pin 3 is not used
Pin 4 is the Voltage output
The shield or case is the common or 'ground'.

You need to swap the connections from pins 1 to 2 in a standard S-Video cable. A normal S-video cable is wired like this:

1 ---- 1
2 ---- 2
3 ---- 3
4 ---- 4
shield ---- sheild

What you want is:

1 ---- 2
2 ---- 1
3 ---- 3
4 ---- 4
shield ---- shield

I modified one S-video cable and have tested it with another Blade transmitter.

To use the training function, leave the student's transmitter OFF, connect the training cable to the instructors transmitter and then the instructor can give the student control by using the spring loaded training switch. Be sure to test the students transmitter to be sure that all the trim settings match the instructors transmitter.


I WILL NOT BE RESPONSIBLE If you try to modify your own cable and cause and damage to your transmitter or helicopter. If you don't know what you are doing and are not electronically inclinded you must ignore this message.

I could probably come up with a Futaba to Blade training cable as well as a JR to blade training cable (or vice versa, Blade to Futaba and JR to Futaba too), but that's not what I had in mind for now and would probably require a lot of setup to match the Futaba/JR transmitter to the Blade transmitter.

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Rich
06-24-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rob_jones
Key Veteran
Location: Oglethorpe, GA

Thanks for the info, Rich! My pal will be disappointed to learn that we can't buddy box (at least not yet). But I'm glad that somebody is trying to figure it out.

There are 2 or 3 Blade owners at my field and I expect there to be more. I would love to be able to help some of these guys by simply borrowing a transmitter from one to buddy box with another.

Do you suppose a "Blade-only" trainer cord is forthcoming from Horizon? I wonder why they see fit to sit on it and not make it available. Are they not familiar with the concept of follow through? The transmitter has a trainer switch and trainer plug, so why is there no cord for it?

Things that make you go "Hmmmmmmmm"....

/end of rant

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Team MRC Hirobo
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
06-24-2005 Over year old.
 
 
ImRich
Veteran
Location: Derry, NH USA

Feel free to mod a cable and let me know if it works for you. It will save me the trouble of testing it.

One of my flight students has two blades now (he wanted spare parts ), so I'm going to borrow one of his transmitters to test the cable I made.

I would think that Horizon could sell a bunch of these cables if they had them.

I can tell you from training others with a heli, you have to have fast reflexes to save a heli with a training cord (I never feel like my reflexes are fast enough), and you'll need even faster reflexes to save the Blade as it's very light and can move quickly.

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Rich
06-24-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rob_jones
Key Veteran
Location: Oglethorpe, GA

It may just me a supplier issue. It happens a lot in the computer biz.

I've used trainer cords on copters before and it's definitely hit and miss. It's better than trying to grab the transmitter away from the student, but certainly not as effective as it is with planks. I explain to students who want to train with one that it's not a guaranteed fail safe. I may not be able to save it if they get too crossed up too low to the ground.

But I figure that there's so little at stake with the Blade, it's a worthwhile risk. I've seen them drop from 30 feet inverted, bounce up in the air, and tumble over. You can just pick it up, straighten the blades and main shaft and keep on flying!

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Team MRC Hirobo
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
06-24-2005 Over year old.
 
 
ImRich
Veteran
Location: Derry, NH USA

HI guys,

I'm happy to report that the Blade training cable works just fine with another Blade transmitter!

I edited my original message to say so and include some simple instructions.

I won't be responsible if you mess up you radio or for anything that is not clear or any errors in the instructions. I'm just reporting that the cable that I made works just fine!

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Rich
06-30-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rob_jones
Key Veteran
Location: Oglethorpe, GA

Thanks, Rich! That's great info!

One question: This might be dumb to ask, but how do you physically swap the pins in the cable? The only S-Video cables I've seen have molded plastic "ends" and look as if they'd be very difficult, if not impossible, to cut open and modify. Is there a trick I don't know about?

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Team MRC Hirobo
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
06-30-2005 Over year old.
 
 
ImRich
Veteran
Location: Derry, NH USA

You can make a cable a few different ways:

1) Go to radio shack and buy a new S-Video connector. Cut one end off and resolder the wires onto the new connector.

2) Get two new S-Video connectors and make your own cable from scratch.

or do what I did:

3) Make a slice into the outer jacket of the cable along the length of the cable in the middle being careful not to cut into the internal wires. This will expose the wires and let you cut two of them, then cross conect them, insulate with heat shrink tubing and then tape up the sliced outer jacket.

Option 3 is very easy to do if you know what your doing. The trick is finding which two wires are the ones you want to cut and swap. Of course you could cut all of them and then resplice them as appropriate.

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Rich
07-01-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
rob_jones
Key Veteran
Location: Oglethorpe, GA

Ah, ok! I get it now. Thanks!

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Team MRC Hirobo
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
07-01-2005 Over year old.
 
 
thrilsekr
Heliman
Location: Central Coast, CA

You can get a trainer cord from www.milehighwings.com
they have both serial and USB made for the blade CP with cp disableing function.

I get mine today in the mail...

Will let you know...
07-08-2005 Over year old.
 
 
rob_jones
Key Veteran
Location: Oglethorpe, GA

Cool. Thanks for the tip. Let us know how it works out!

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Team MRC Hirobo
I reject your reality and substitute my own.
07-08-2005 Over year old.
 
 
bluesky123
Heliman
Location: Boulder, Colorado, US

thrilsekr,

milehighwings.com sells simulator interfaces, not trainer cords! Simulator interface connects a transmitter to a computer (in order to let you control a simulator using your transmitter), while trainer cable (also called a "buddy cord") connects two transmitters and let two people, an instructor and a student, control the same helicopter in turns using two transmitters.

A simulator interface cable was a hard thing to do (I've reversed engineered the CCPM mix parameters and my colleague implemented the un-mixing in the firmware) as we had to extract the un-mixed channel signals out of the CCPM mixed stream. A trainer cord is a different story: when you use two identical Blade CP transmitters (or, for that matter, ESky 6ch or Twister CP TXs), you can send CCPM mixed signal from the student's TX to the instructors TX, which will transmit it without any problems. I believe I've seen a mention of this in ESky manual.

Is it possible to use Blade's TX with a transmitter of a different kind? May be... If I remember right, mu Futaba 9C has two ways of dealing with a slave transmitter, connected via a buddy cord:
1) 9C interprets the received PPM data stream and applies its own mixings on student's channel signals prior to transmitting them to the air. In this mode, 9C won't be able to works with Blade's TX, unless the buddy cord implements CCPM un-mixing (that would be one expensive buddy cord!).
2) 9C simply receives the slave's signal and immediately transmits it. Assuming that the PPM streams of Blade and Futaba are compatible (except for ever present CCPM mixing on Blade's side), this might well work. I should solder a simple miniDIN-to-Futaba mini cable and give it a try.


Boris
07-08-2005 Over year old.
 
 
xDevDogx
Heliman
Location: Washington

Has anyone tried to make a cable for the Tx to work with FMS? I have made the Trainer Cable, and it works great!! I would like to use the Tx for FMS so I can still fly while I am waiting for the batteries to charge.
07-11-2005 Over year old.
 
 
bluesky123
Heliman
Location: Boulder, Colorado, US

Interface cable for FMS

xDevDogx,

See my previous post--in order to use Blade's TX with any simulator, an interface must un-mix the CCPM-mixed channels. This can only be done by interface's microchip and that's exactly what is implemented in CCPM interfaces sold at www.milehighwings.com.

Boris
07-11-2005 Over year old.
 
 
xDevDogx
Heliman
Location: Washington

Interface Cable for Blade and FMS

OK, well I guess its time to put my ITT Tech education to good use. I am currently in the process of designing a circuit for this. I will keep you posted on my progress. It will be PIC 12c508a based.


Thanks!!
07-11-2005 Over year old.
 
 
ImRich
Veteran
Location: Derry, NH USA

This was originally a trainer cord availability question. We've figured out how to make a trainer cord for the Blade that works well and is very inexpensive to make if you can solder and can follow electrical instructions.

The instructions for making the training cable above work well. If a friend has a spare S-Video cable that came with a camcorder or a DVD player, it won't cost you anything. Otherwise it may cost $10 to $25 for you to buy a new cable at Radio shack, or try any other store where they sell TVs, camcorders or DVD players. Even Wal-Mart has these things!

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Rich
07-11-2005 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
thrilsekr
Heliman
Location: Central Coast, CA

I have the trainer cord from milehighwings.


It works great. But I cannot get it to work for pre-flight software. It works for FMS just fine. Except in my opinion FMS is not a very good simulator. I can fly all day long in FMS, but don't last 30 seconds with my blade.
FMS hovering is automatic just give it some power, it goes straight up and will stay right there without any input. I wish it was that easy.

Thrilsekr
07-11-2005 Over year old.
 
 
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e-E-Flite Blade CP mCX CX 400-3D > Blade Trainer Cord?
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