RunRyder - Everytime I roll, I end up in a hover, what gives??

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JR Heli Vibe - Airskipper - Sylphide - Venture > Everytime I roll, I end up in a hover, what gives??

Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

I've been flying my Jr Venture for a month, and it seems that whenever I roll it, when it comes back right side up, I end up in a Hover. Today, one time after I rolled it, it actually ended up flying backwards, any tips?? Daz...

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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vetrider
Elite Veteran
Location: Daleville, AL (Ft.Rucker)

Could be several things...... your heli may be Tail heavy......hook your fingers under the flybar close the the head but not binding anything and lift up till the skids are just off the ground. The rear skids shoud be up before the front clears.
You may have some interaction in your control or the phasing of the swash plate. That'll take some investigation from someone experianced.

Nolan

Nolan Manley
MA Stratus-ATOM 500-K3D-TRex600Npro-Logo14
Magnum Fuel, KBDDintl

07-28-2002 Over year old.

andymcallister
Veteran
Location: Palm Beach, Florida

It could also be that you are being naturally cautious and pulling up on the cyclic before you enter, just make sure you don't change the position of the nose from fast forward flight and it should carry on through the whole thing.
Hope this helps.

07-28-2002 Over year old.

Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

Andy, I think you hit the nail on the head. I am use to pulling the nose up b4 entering a roll. Maybe tomorrow I will try to do it in FFF without changing my nose pitch, and see. Sometimes I have a good one and most are not. But like I said 90% of the time, I think I pull the nose up b4 entry. Thanks, Daz...

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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heliman41
Key Veteran
Location: Valparaiso IN. USA

You got it, when you roll dont do anything out of the ordinary till its almost inverted then add back cyclic, push forward cyclic as it comes back upright. If you dont do this it will sort of barrel roll. It will take finesse but you'll get the feel quick.

07-28-2002 Over year old.

TheBigE
Senior Heliman
Location: Indiana

Daz,

Part of it could be the paddles, not sure which ones your are flying (i.e the "3D" ones or the beginner paddles) or the blades. But both can have effect on the pitchness of the helicopter. I am flying the Venture with the 3D paddles (CF Blades), and the first couple of rolls I did, I found that the helicopter would pitch up and when I came back right side up on the heli I would be in a hover. I suspect the situation is magnified if you are using the wood blades (don't ask me why it just seemed like the woodies are more "pitchy"), to be honest I am not sure about the beginner paddles, since I did not fly them.

After flying a couple of tanks through the heli, I found that if you are in FFF then you are less likely of being in a hover after a roll. If you want to do a slower roll (i.e less forward speed) you may have to give a little back cyclic when inverted to keep the heli moving forward. After doing a few rolls you get used to the helicopter.

I am having a great time with mine, getting ready for the crop circle contest that I am sure will be held at the Deleware FF at the end of August. LOL.

Hope this helps, and good luck tomorrow.

Erik

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

Cant wait to try it tomorrow, that makes sense. I've been flying planes for 12 years, and I'm so use to a little nose up when entering a roll, now I have to break that habit.

I'm using the Raptor 30 paddles with the stock woods, but I will be getting some better blades for it next week. I never tried the supplied 3D paddles because I didnt see any way to lock them down with a set screw, looks like they just screw on.

I think between me practicing this manuever as described above, it will go better. Daz...

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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TheBigE
Senior Heliman
Location: Indiana

Daz,

Yeah, it took me awhile to break that habit too from my airplane days, but once broken it will become second nature. Now when I fly a plank I usually have to force my self to make it a little nose up prior to the roll, furthermore I have to concentrate and not pull back on the left stick. (that is hard)

I just used a couple of drops of Pacer Poly Zap on the flybar and paddles after everything was aligned. I used to be a believer in the positive lock using a set screw, but lately I have been using poly zap and the "tightness" of the paddle on the flybar to hold them in place. It is kinda leap of faith, I do the same thing on my 60 machine with the grey KSJ paddles, in the past I would JB weld the the paddles on and then if I ever wanted to change paddles it was impossible...and if I had a crash where I turned the flybar into a pretzel, it was impossible to get flybar out. Just an observation.

Erik

07-28-2002 Over year old.

HOMEPAGE

Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

I think tomorrow when I try it, it should go much better. I have to focus on that more. Thanks, Daz...

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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The_Dave
Veteran
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada

Check your CG

I agree with vertrider, you are most likely tail heavy. Even if you are pulling slightly "up" when you enter the roll you should still carry forward momentum. The roll would be more like a barrel roll than anything else but it should keep moving. Check the CG and get it slightly nose heavy and you will have a new helo! Also remember, when rolling you want to keep you collective very close to zero pitch, let the cyclic do its job and carry the machine through the roll.

CHECK THE CG!

Mark McAlpine - 2005 - We will never forget.

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

When I lifted the Heli up by the flybar, the front skids raised up slightly 1st. So if it is tail heavy, how do I fix that. I dont want to add weight because the Venture could already use some more power??

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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Cassini
Senior Heliman
Location: Enterprise, AL

move your battery pack as far forward as you can get it... move anything that can be relocated forward...

If this still won't bring it in, then you will have to add weight. You can make that weight usefull in going to a larger battery pack.

I have to add a large socket and about 5 large allen wrenches to the front of my Sceadu to bring it into balance.

In achieving the balance what you want is the rear of the skids to lift about a 1/4 inch before the front of the skids lift off of the surface it is resting on when you lift by the flybar.

07-28-2002 Over year old.

The_Dave
Veteran
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada

Correcting CG

SEE! I knew it would be tail heavy! OK, you have to move some radio equiptment to shift it forward...where is your gyro located? Up front I hope! If I had to guess I bet you have a tail boom mounted servo as well...

Nonetheless, you need to shift as much weight as you can forward, move your battery, get your gyro up front (where it belongs anyway) and so on. If you HAVE to add weight then add it...your machine will never fly right tail heavy. You should be able to get it by just moving the weight around.

Mark McAlpine - 2005 - We will never forget.

07-28-2002 Over year old.

HOMEPAGE

Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

I will balance it then, that makes sense. I'm using a 1400 mah Nicd pack, I can install a 2700 mah pack and see if it gets better. I already have everything mounted as far forward as possible. The gyro is located up front along with battery and Rx. I'm not using a tail mounted servo, thats upfront too. Daz...

07-28-2002 Over year old.

HOMEPAGE

The_Dave
Veteran
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada

Very Good! No go fourth and roll!

Mark McAlpine - 2005 - We will never forget.

07-28-2002 Over year old.

HOMEPAGE

vetrider
Elite Veteran
Location: Daleville, AL (Ft.Rucker)

If all that doesn't get the CG inline then it's time for the old DREMEL GRINDER AND A GOOD DRILL!!!!!!!!!!

Let's see

............. Jr Venture CHEESE

Nolan Manley
MA Stratus-ATOM 500-K3D-TRex600Npro-Logo14
Magnum Fuel, KBDDintl

07-28-2002 Over year old.

andymcallister
Veteran
Location: Palm Beach, Florida

Ouch! Poor Venture! LOL hope you get it flying good!

07-28-2002 Over year old.

ExtremelyFurious
Senior Heliman
Location: Mobile, AL

Time out...

The fuel tank on the Venture is located in front of the CG. Are you checking it empty or full? This will make a big difference in balance. If you fuel it up and it is still tail heavy, you have a problem. If not, then more than likely you are feeding in cyclic during the roll stopping the chopper....

My two cents worth...

Scott

[color=blue][b]Put A Fork In Me...I'm Done[/b][/color] [color=red]Member ACMA Mobile, AL[/c

07-28-2002 Over year old.

Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

I checked my CG with the tank empty, and it was very slighly tail heavy, when I put the fuel in it, it balances fine, the rear lifts off first. So are you suppose to balance with a full or empty tank???

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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heliman41
Key Veteran
Location: Valparaiso IN. USA

I balance with a 1/2 full tank myself sorta in the middle of the flight to say. Either way front tank or rear tank location the middle bal is closest as you will have to either change trim or compensate for it kinda sucks you would think by now someone could figure out a setup that balances perfect no matter how much fuel was in the tank ie: tank mounted directly and centrally under the mainshaft. Anyway this works best for me.

07-28-2002 Over year old.

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JR Heli Vibe - Airskipper - Sylphide - Venture > Everytime I roll, I end up in a hover, what gives??

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